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The president of the University of Maryland made a statement that UNC getting the 'death penalty' would be appropriate.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...t-wallace-loh-unc-academic-scandal/100317350/

As a Duke fan, I give that a moment of thought -- would that be good for college basketball? Would that be good for Duke?

I grew up in Dallas and remember the SMU death penalty. It killed SMU's athletics, and it has never really recovered.

I think UNC did something wrong (really wrong), but a death penalty is basically a scorched-earth policy. I sincerely believe that Duke's success in basketball is tied very closely with UNC's. In the long run a severe penalty will end up hurting the ACC, Duke, and college basketball. Call me self-serving, but a punishment against the Tar Heels that is too severe does not help Duke.

Any thoughts out there (like I have to ask)
 
This was brought up earlier and I just added it to DevilDJs thread since it's all related for those who want to discuss.
 
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LTDukeFan said:
The president of the University of Maryland made a statement that UNC getting the 'death penalty' would be appropriate.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...t-wallace-loh-unc-academic-scandal/100317350/

As a Duke fan, I give that a moment of thought -- would that be good for college basketball? Would that be good for Duke?

I grew up in Dallas and remember the SMU death penalty. It killed SMU's athletics, and it has never really recovered.

I think UNC did something wrong (really wrong), but a death penalty is basically a scorched-earth policy. I sincerely believe that Duke's success in basketball is tied very closely with UNC's. In the long run a severe penalty will end up hurting the ACC, Duke, and college basketball. Call me self-serving, but a punishment against the Tar Heels that is too severe does not help Duke.

Any thoughts out there (like I have to ask)
Click to expand...

I think it's deserved. SMU's issue revolved around a slush fund to pay players and their families to attend SMU. UNC's is a scandal going on for 2 decades and involves multiple sports. I'm sure we could come up with a huge list of wrongdoings on UNC's part with this scandal. This is bigger than SMU's scandal in my opinion.

I disagree with the thought of ACC and Duke doing worse if UNC is punished. We'll be fine. ACC will be fine. If UNC isn't punished this will set precedent that the world of college sports does NOT need.

EDIT: Oh and now Charlotte Observer has picked the story up as well FYI.
 
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LTDukeFan said:
The president of the University of Maryland made a statement that UNC getting the 'death penalty' would be appropriate.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...t-wallace-loh-unc-academic-scandal/100317350/

As a Duke fan, I give that a moment of thought -- would that be good for college basketball? Would that be good for Duke?

I grew up in Dallas and remember the SMU death penalty. It killed SMU's athletics, and it has never really recovered.

I think UNC did something wrong (really wrong), but a death penalty is basically a scorched-earth policy. I sincerely believe that Duke's success in basketball is tied very closely with UNC's. In the long run a severe penalty will end up hurting the ACC, Duke, and college basketball. Call me self-serving, but a punishment against the Tar Heels that is too severe does not help Duke.

Any thoughts out there (like I have to ask)
Click to expand...
It didn't kill Kentucky basketball.
 
I think a severe penalty is warranted and deserved in this case. You just can't let the biggest cheating scandal in the history of college sports get off the hook with a wrist slap. The NCAA would never have grounds to punish anyone afterwards if that happened.
 
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Oh and let's be brutally honest here, punishment for the scandal will not cripple the athletic department of UNC like it did SMU. UNC may not be getting the top recruits, but they're still getting great players who come in despite the scandal. There have even been top recruits who have or are seriously considering UNC despite the scandal. People will feel ashamed and embarrassed for a few years, but they'll "get over it" and in 5 years, everything will start going back uphill for UNC anyway.
 
MikeD2891 said:
Oh and let's be brutally honest here, punishment for the scandal will not cripple the athletic department of UNC like it did SMU. UNC may not be getting the top recruits, but they're still getting great players who come in despite the scandal. There have even been top recruits who have or are seriously considering UNC despite the scandal. People will feel ashamed and embarrassed for a few years, but they'll "get over it" and in 5 years, everything will start going back uphill for UNC anyway.
Click to expand...
I guess we'll have to disagree on "the degree" to which UNC will be affected...."Oh and let's be brutally honest here, punishment for the scandal will not cripple the athletic department of UNC like it did SMU." The death penalty would cripple the program -- actually kill it for a period -- that's why its called the "death penalty". As far as I know, it was only implemented on SMU and the results sort of speak for themselves. The only thing that we are seeing is the results of UNC postponing the punishment -- not the punishment itself.

Take away wins -- fine
Take away championships -- fine
Take away scholarships -- fine
Take away the basketball program -- NOT fine

If someone thinks that I'm being a UNC apologist, then someone got beat with a dumb-stick.
 
Our only satisfaction is for this to hurt recruiting but that's only going to last for so long when recruits realize that nothing is going to come of it. OFC
 
CHAPEL HILL


University of Maryland President Wallace Loh said during an on-campus meeting last week that he “would think” that the NCAA investigation into UNC-Chapel Hill would ultimately lead to the NCAA levying the so-called “death penalty” against the university.

Loh made the comments during a University of Maryland senate meeting last Thursday. An audio file of a portion of the meeting, which was open to the public, was sent on Monday to The News & Observer. Loh’s commentary about UNC came during a question-and-answer portion of the meeting.

loh

University of Maryland President Wallace Loh AP

i
University of Maryland President Wallace Loh AP
[Who is Wallace Loh?]

An individual who identified himself as a member of the University of Maryland faculty asked Loh how he could be certain that the university is “protected from the corrupting influence of athletics.” In response, Loh made an unprompted reference to UNC.

“As president I sit over a number of dormant volcanoes,” Loh said. “One of them is an athletic scandal. It blows up, it blows up the university, its reputation, it blows up the president.


“For the things that happened in North Carolina, it’s abysmal. I would think that this would lead to the implementation of the death penalty by the NCAA. But I’m not in charge of that.”

Few college presidents and athletic directors, if any, have so openly called for significant sanctions at UNC, which has been under an NCAA investigation since June 2014. That’s when the NCAA Enforcement Staff reopened an investigation it closed, for the first time, in 2012.

Read more here: http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/college/acc/unc/article143811894.html#storylink=cpy
 
LTDukeFan said:
I guess we'll have to disagree on "the degree" to which UNC will be affected...."Oh and let's be brutally honest here, punishment for the scandal will not cripple the athletic department of UNC like it did SMU." The death penalty would cripple the program -- actually kill it for a period -- that's why its called the "death penalty". As far as I know, it was only implemented on SMU and the results sort of speak for themselves. The only thing that we are seeing is the results of UNC postponing the punishment -- not the punishment itself.

Take away wins -- fine
Take away championships -- fine
Take away scholarships -- fine
Take away the basketball program -- NOT fine

If someone thinks that I'm being a UNC apologist, then someone got beat with a dumb-stick.
Click to expand...

Yeah but it only cripples and kills the program for its duration. You've got to be kidding me if you believe that the recruits would not eventually start returning to UNC. Probably not under Roy but if they get another guy of his caliber or better, they'll eventually start coming back to UNC. Was SMU a powerhouse in college football when the death penalty happened? UNC is one of the top men's basketball programs in the nation. It would be a temporary setback. UNC is a major school and their fans and players blindly follow the place. There's never been more evidence IMO than the fact that they're still getting good recruits during all of this. The guys who grew up watching Duke-UNC who were UNC fans growing up still came to the place despite the scandal.

Yeah a lot of people and more specifically UNC athletes probably believe nothing will come out of this, but these kids are taking a HUGE risk with coming to UNC anyway.
 
MikeD2891 said:
Yeah but it only cripples and kills the program for its duration. You've got to be kidding me if you believe that the recruits would not eventually start returning to UNC. Probably not under Roy but if they get another guy of his caliber or better, they'll eventually start coming back to UNC. Was SMU a powerhouse in college football when the death penalty happened? UNC is one of the top men's basketball programs in the nation. It would be a temporary setback. UNC is a major school and their fans and players blindly follow the place. There's never been more evidence IMO than the fact that they're still getting good recruits during all of this. The guys who grew up watching Duke-UNC who were UNC fans growing up still came to the place despite the scandal.

Yeah a lot of people and more specifically UNC athletes probably believe nothing will come out of this, but these kids are taking a HUGE risk with coming to UNC anyway.
Click to expand...

At the time, SMU was a perennial top 20 school and it never recovered after the scandal. I am not sure of the effects that the penalties will cause for UNC (and I am speaking in the affirmative), but I think they will shell-shocked.
 
Last edited:
MikeD2891 said:
I disagree with the thought of ACC and Duke doing worse if UNC is punished. We'll be fine. ACC will be fine. If UNC isn't punished this will set precedent that the world of college sports does NOT need.
Click to expand...

Again , agree. Letting unx skate , sets the stage for a total revamp of the NCAA. Maybe that's the end-game. The NCAA keeps receiving money but players get a cut , academics are whatever and the P5 polices itself...if at all. Wouldn't shock me. The holes have shown a commitment to not paying the price for any of this and , other than the AANOA , the NCAA seems perfectly willing to let 'em have their way. I still say the punishment won't come NEAR being what's justified. We'll see.
 
MikeD2891 said:
Oh and let's be brutally honest here, punishment for the scandal will not cripple the athletic department of UNC like it did SMU. UNC may not be getting the top recruits, but they're still getting great players who come in despite the scandal. There have even been top recruits who have or are seriously considering UNC despite the scandal. People will feel ashamed and embarrassed for a few years, but they'll "get over it" and in 5 years, everything will start going back uphill for UNC anyway.
Click to expand...

unx is , unfortunately , one of a select few schools who COULD absorb a "Death Penalty" and bounce back relatively quickly. Seven years an' countin' as of now. Between 2010 and 2013 , the holes coulda taken those sanctions , had a couple of down years and be right back where they started. Personally , this is the one area where I actually MISJUDGED tptb at the flagship. Before this , I woulda always stated how arrogant and delusional they were. But 18 million dollars ( conservative number , btw ) and 7 YEARS?! Woulda never thought they were THAT delusional and arrogant. Again , woulda said it. Never actually believed it though. Anyway , unx coulda suffered for a minute , be back at the top AND be able to brag that the "carolina way" is everything they always claimed it was. That ship's sailed.
 
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LTDukeFan said:
The president of the University of Maryland made a statement that UNC getting the 'death penalty' would be appropriate.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...t-wallace-loh-unc-academic-scandal/100317350/

As a Duke fan, I give that a moment of thought -- would that be good for college basketball? Would that be good for Duke?

I grew up in Dallas and remember the SMU death penalty. It killed SMU's athletics, and it has never really recovered.

I think UNC did something wrong (really wrong), but a death penalty is basically a scorched-earth policy. I sincerely believe that Duke's success in basketball is tied very closely with UNC's. In the long run a severe penalty will end up hurting the ACC, Duke, and college basketball. Call me self-serving, but a punishment against the Tar Heels that is too severe does not help Duke.

Any thoughts out there (like I have to ask)
Click to expand...


I understand what you are saying but I hope unc gets the death penalty. I don't care what it does to the rivalry . They cheated big time and are so arrogant. I want to see their fan base shrivel down to nothing. I want to see the Walmart shelves and racks bare of unc gear. Even though they may think they are entitled and feel they are above all standards of integrity they are not. They need to be punished severely no matter what the cost or who's reputation is put in it's place. If it were any other school punishment would have already been in place. I would feel this way if this had happened at Duke and Coach K was behind it all and knew about it all. I would want him and everyone involved to be fired and start over again. Sports in this country has went the way of everything else in this country and that's in the gutter. If unc gets by with this college sports will never be the same again. I have always been a Duke fan no matter what and always will be a Duke fan no matter what. OFC
 
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MikeD2891 said:
Man! More and more media outlets are picking it up! keep this train moving!
Click to expand...

Having a college president say it is exactly what's been needed. Unfortunately , Maryland is in the Big 10. Their commissioner is Jim Delany. Hole...

The 69-year old Delany is a native of South Orange, N.J. He received his undergraduate degree in political science from the University of North Carolina in 1970 and juris doctorate degree from the University of North Carolina School of Law in 1973. At UNC, Delany was a three-year member of the varsity basketball team, serving as tri-captain in 1970 and twice participating in NCAA Final Four competition. In September 2012, Delany received the UNC Distinguished Alumni Award.

After earning his law degree, Delany served as counsel for the North Carolina Senate Judiciary Committee from 1973 to 1974, and was staff attorney for the North Carolina Justice Department from 1974 to 1975.

http://www.bigten.org/school-bio/delany-bio.html


Not sure if any of Loh's peers will voice similar opinions.
 
skysdad said:
I understand what you are saying but I hope unc gets the death penalty. I don't care what it does to the rivalry . They cheated big time and are so arrogant. I want to see their fan base shrivel down to nothing. I want to see the Walmart shelves and racks bare of unc gear. Even though they may think they are entitled and feel they are above all standards of integrity they are not. They need to be punished severely no matter what the cost or who's reputation is put in it's place. If it were any other school punishment would have already been in place. I would feel this way if this had happened at Duke and Coach K was behind it all and knew about it all. I would want him and everyone involved to be fired and start over again. Sports in this country has went the way of everything else in this country and that's in the gutter. If unc gets by with this college sports will never be the same again. I have always been a Duke fan no matter what and always will be a Duke fan no matter what. OFC
Click to expand...

You know @skysdad, I understand.
 
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He ain't wrong...

UNC scandal '10 times worse' than U of L strippers

If there ever was a death penalty case in recent memory, this is one. But when you look at how much the NCAA has tried to run away from this, I would bet a ton of money on it never being enacted again for a Power Five school.’’

“As sordid and as scummy as the Louisville allegations are, it doesn’t even come close (to North Carolina),” Ridpath said. “This is the absolute worst thing that can be done: academic misconduct, lack of academic integrity or academic manipulation. It goes to the very core of what the NCAA stands for. ...

"If the NCAA does nothing, they really need to pack up and not do enforcement anymore. ... My hope is the penalties will be pretty severe. If they would take away the championship banners (from 2005 and 2009), that would send a message.”

To call Carolina’s arguments claptrap would be too kind...If this does not lead to the NCAA's death penalty, nothing should.

http://www.courier-journal.com/stor...-10-times-worse-than-u-l-strippers/100319908/
 
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DevilDJ said:
He ain't wrong...

UNC scandal '10 times worse' than U of L strippers

If there ever was a death penalty case in recent memory, this is one. But when you look at how much the NCAA has tried to run away from this, I would bet a ton of money on it never being enacted again for a Power Five school.’’

“As sordid and as scummy as the Louisville allegations are, it doesn’t even come close (to North Carolina),” Ridpath said. “This is the absolute worst thing that can be done: academic misconduct, lack of academic integrity or academic manipulation. It goes to the very core of what the NCAA stands for. ...

"If the NCAA does nothing, they really need to pack up and not do enforcement anymore. ... My hope is the penalties will be pretty severe. If they would take away the championship banners (from 2005 and 2009), that would send a message.”

To call Carolina’s arguments claptrap would be too kind...If this does not lead to the NCAA's death penalty, nothing should.

http://www.courier-journal.com/stor...-10-times-worse-than-u-l-strippers/100319908/
Click to expand...

I agree that what ever happens to unc should happen to all programs. OFC
 
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LOL they are now preparing their response. Well, this could be another two months before we hear anything else. No way they can prepare it any quicker unless they mean it's already written and they're just doing the editing now. This really is going to drag out to the last possible minute.

The one thing I wonder is how can the NCAA end this cycle? I know based on previous posts in this thread I believe, it's been said that NCAA has a new case to concentrate on at the end of the year (Q4 is what I read I believe) so it would have to end before that. However, UNC's response could be them self-reporting once again like they have the last so many times. If so, then this won't be able to end without UNC putting NCAA into a position to be sued. Maybe I just don't understand this part?
 
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unc nation don't even care they were caught cheating. How pathetic is that. OFC
 
skysdad said:
unc nation don't even care they were caught cheating. How pathetic is that. OFC
Click to expand...

Would appear so and , yes , it's pathetic. If Duke had just been outted for decades of cheating that directly led to athletic success , I'd be damned if I'd be struttin' around like my sheet don't stink. They do. Speaks volumes. That said , unx is absolutely shameless. Check this...

Sankey Recusal Requested from UNC Case

The SEC commissioner's potential conflict of interest continues to raise red flags.

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey’s removal as Committee on Infractions chairman due to a conflict of interest in the University of North Carolina’s prolonged NCAA investigation has been officially requested.

http://www.scout.com/college/north-...m_medium=HootSuitePost&utm_campaign=HootSuite


Two things:

1) John Swofford is an alum and former athlete of unx. He's also ACC commish. How is THAT not a "conflict of interest" and why hasn't unx ever conceded as much and made any effort to correct it? IOW , why are the holes selective as a mofo about what IS and ISN'T a "conflict of interest?" Rhetorical question , btw. We all KNOW why. And...

2) Greg Barnes is a shameless as they come. Sankey's "potential conflict of interest continues to raise red flags?!" Says who? Oh yeah. That's right. No one...except Greg. Gawd. Talk about "fake news." He intentionally suggests that as if it were fact. It ain't. unx'ers have no problem with Swofford , no problem with unx alum Jim Woodall interjecting himself into their investigation , no problem with Allen Baddour presiding over aspects of Nyangoro's case , no problem with the NC BOG ( so vocal during Valvano's days! ) being stocked like a trout pond with unx alums , no problem with Jim Martin orchestrating a dog-n-pony show to exonerate athletics...no problems with ANY of that. ALL rife with "conflicts of interest" that , to date , unx has raised zero objections to. Typical.

C9PRBWbXcAIwA8Q.jpg
 
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DevilDJ said:
Would appear so and , yes , it's pathetic. If Duke had just been outted for decades of cheating that directly led to athletic success , I'd be damned if I'd be struttin' around like my sheet don't stink. They do. Speaks volumes. That said , unx is absolutely shameless. Check this...

Sankey Recusal Requested from UNC Case

The SEC commissioner's potential conflict of interest continues to raise red flags.

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey’s removal as Committee on Infractions chairman due to a conflict of interest in the University of North Carolina’s prolonged NCAA investigation has been officially requested.

http://www.scout.com/college/north-...m_medium=HootSuitePost&utm_campaign=HootSuite


Two things:

1) John Swofford is an alum and former athlete of unx. He's also ACC commish. How is THAT not a "conflict of interest" and why hasn't unx ever conceded as much and made any effort to correct it? IOW , why are the holes selective as a mofo about what IS and ISN'T a "conflict of interest?" Rhetorical question , btw. We all KNOW why. And...

2) Greg Barnes is a shameless as they come. Sankey's "potential conflict of interest continues to raise red flags?!" Says who? Oh yeah. That's right. No one...except Greg. Gawd. Talk about "fake news." He intentionally suggests that as if it were fact. It ain't. unx'ers have no problem with Swofford , no problem with unx alum Jim Woodall interjecting himself into their investigation , no problem with Allen Baddour presiding over aspects of Nyangoro's case , no problem with the NC BOG ( so vocal during Valvano's days! ) being stocked like a trout pond with unx alums , no problem with Jim Martin orchestrating a dog-n-pony show to exonerate athletics...no problems with ANY of that. ALL rife with "conflicts of interest" that , to date , unx has raised zero objections to. Typical.

C9PRBWbXcAIwA8Q.jpg
Click to expand...






#johnnyknew. OFC
 
Truth hurts , huh Roy...?

Roy Williams refers to Maryland president as 'double idiot' after death penalty comments

North Carolina coach Roy Williams fired back at University of Maryland president Wallace Loh on Wednesday during an interview with SirusXM College Sports Nation.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...vestigation-death-penalty-comments/100372392/



"Who cares about sum hifalutin book-larnin' when ya kin hide in the bushes while yer buddy begs fer a dadgum crip class...?"

C9PZxNGXYAEWyh_.jpg
 
Just noticed something about "LetsGoDukies" link...

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/education/unc-scandal/article144125689.html

In two letters that were sent recently to NCAA enforcement officials and provided to The News & Observer on Tuesday evening, attorney Elliot Abrams contends the NCAA’s enforcement staff rushed its third and latest notice of allegations after being “pressured” by the infractions committee to come up with a tougher version.

C9OHTLEXgAE118q.jpg


C9OHTjjXgAAy9xy.jpg


Ok , holes. Which is it? All we hear is unx whining about the mean ol' NCAA and their process being too long. NOW , they're betchin' because things seem "rushed." Again. Which is it?
 
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