The Carters

[jwill133]

Duke’s defense hasn’t suffered because of the OAD, we are getting better athletes than ever, they should be terrific lockdown defenders.

Duke’s defense has suffered because of the “hand-check” rules changes that started going into effect right after our 2010 title. NCAA basketball seemed to hit an all-time low in the 2011 UCONN-Butler title game, quite possibly the ugliest basketball game ever. Notice how most games are scored in the 80’s nowadays???

K’s style of defense was traditionally to hound the man with the ball, simply: you aren’t aloud to play that kind of defense anymore. Duke has never really adjusted to a different type of defense (outside of a panic button zone).

 

[timo0402]

Because that bit is/was central to his overall point, correct?

Starting 3 SGs, with nary a hint of PG ability between them, with 2 of them being horrific defenders, and making the 3rd (who was a good defender at his position) defend out of position at PG, was simply untenable. If there had been a top tier rim protecting C behind them.....It still wouldn't have worked.
.
We'd have had to have shot 40+ percent on 25 3pt APG for that lineup to have worked.

I was pointing out his inaccurate statement. As for his overall point i disagree. Rules changed and i also think you see a lot of folks accuse kids of not investing enough or not wanting it bad enough. however i think it’s more that they just don’t know what they don’t know. They’re better athletes and there are no physical excuses to play solid defense but playing solid defense in the way K likes to play it, takes time. Time we don’t have.

 

[Mac9192]

Duke’s defense hasn’t suffered because of the OAD, we are getting better athletes than ever, they should be terrific lockdown defenders.

Duke’s defense has suffered because of the “hand-check” rules changes that started going into effect right after our 2010 title. NCAA basketball seemed to hit an all-time low in the 2011 UCONN-Butler title game, quite possibly the ugliest basketball game ever. Notice how most games are scored in the 80’s nowadays???

K’s style of defense was traditionally to hound the man with the ball, simply: you aren’t aloud to play that kind of defense anymore. Duke has never really adjusted to a different type of defense (outside of a panic button zone).

I wish what you're saying was true, but it's not. Yes, we do get better athletes, and yes, the rules have changed as far as hand checking, but that's not why we don't play good defense.
We don't play good defense because K's system requires communicating, and guys rotating over. It has always had veterans, usually at least 2-3 to blend with any newcomer to make it work. The kids coming in for their brief stay don't know how to do either. His defense can only work if there's good communication and guys helping. That's why he went zone.

 

[QC Dukie]

Are we the only team that can’t handcheck anymore? There are other teams that play great defense since the rule change. I guess you have to want to play D.

 

[hart2chesson]

Duke’s defense hasn’t suffered because of the OAD, we are getting better athletes than ever, they should be terrific lockdown defenders.

Duke’s defense has suffered because of the “hand-check” rules changes that started going into effect right after our 2010 title.

Respectfully disagree.Obviously hounding the man with the ball with your hands is very important, but "terrific lockdown defenders" slide side to side w/their man, and stay between him and the basket. I've seen us get beat way too much off the dribble because of fundamentals like the one I noted, as well as lack of communication, and poor help side defense.

OFC

 

[jwill133]

Hence why the only good defense’s these days play a very conservative style of defense.
See UVA. The only way to play good defense is to pack the lane.

K ain’t having that. Top recruits won’t show anything playing that boring style of defense...it is what it is.

 

[Showenuff]

I think everyone is trying to nail poor defense as of late to one thing, truth be known it's most likely a compilation of all mentioned here. Hand checking rules have changed the game, greatly, but the early exits kill us as well. It's just common sense that a young man can learn a whole lot more in 2 or 3 years than he can one. It definitely grinds on your mind just how good our past teams could have been without all the early exits, but its how the game is evolving, you simply can not let top talent go in the attempt to lengthen the time spent here. And of course, the kids we are scooping up now aren't taught early how to play D worth a damn. They are scoring, scoring, scoring and showcasing that offense and playing lame HS D. I don't think Coach honestly knows how to teach them his intricate defensive style in a short amount of time. Thus he blew our old minds and started playing zone, honestly, for many years I NEVER would have believed that would happen.

 

[skysdad]

Deep into this thread and the 1st. time I saw it I went back to my childhood and my parents, grandma, and aunts and uncles who were country folk always talking about the Carter's so I thought it was about the 1st. family of country music " The Carter Family," Mother Maybelle, June Carter Cash and the rest of the clan. Shows how old I am. OFC

 

[jwill133]

I wish what you're saying was true, but it's not. Yes, we do get better athletes, and yes, the rules have changed as far as hand checking, but that's not why we don't play good defense.
We don't play good defense because K's system requires communicating, and guys rotating over. It has always had veterans, usually at least 2-3 to blend with any newcomer to make it work. The kids coming in for their brief stay don't know how to do either. His defense can only work if there's good communication and guys helping. That's why he went zone.

2014 we had one OAD, Jabari. Our best player by far, poor defender. Your dream scenario of blending vets with a OAD.
2014 was our worst Ken Pom rated defense over the last 10 years.
Every other player had been in the system multiple years, including Rodney Hood. I fail to see the correlation between multiple year guys and good defense.

 

[Mac9192]

2014 we had one OAD, Jabari. Our best player by far, poor defender. Your dream scenario of blending vets with a OAD.
2014 was our worst Ken Pom rated defense over the last 10 years.
Every other player had been in the system multiple years, including Rodney Hood. I fail to see the correlation between multiple year guys and good defense.

You're one of the few who don't see the correlation between one and done players and good Duke team defense. You also cherry picked a good year to make fun of Duke. We had no rim protector, unless you count Plumlee, who was a sophomore, and unfortunately, not that good. Not to mention, it wasn't a good year for or by K. He lost his brother, who he was very close to.
Most of those guys had heart, but a few lacked talent, at least the type of talent that one would expect to play for Duke.
I never said a veteran would equal greatness, but a solid veteran with the right mix around him will. See 2015.

 

[jwill133]

I never said a veteran would equal greatness, but a solid veteran with the right mix around him will. See 2015.

You’re right. But still, the best defensive player on the 2015 team was a OAD freshman, lol.

Justise was a 3 month defensive god.

 

[bullettoothtony]

Overplay man-to-man that K prefers extends the coverage area and therefore puts a premium on rotations and communication. With most players it simply takes time to learn how to play that style effectively, and it's particularly difficult for first-year guys to master. And since we've become increasingly reliant on young, inexperienced players... well, there's your problem. These problems are exacerbated by a thin bench of course (someone posted info awhile back about how many points our defense gave up in the 2nd half of our NCAA Tourney losses since Villanova, whenever that was. Even though I knew it conceptually, it was still astonishing to see it in black and white. And those episodes weren't coincidences or the result of bad luck. Just bad strategy).

As long as we're overly reliant on one-and-dones, i'd prefer that we employ a gap defensive strategy instead of a deny defensive strategy.

I thought acknowledging our change in defensive strategy this past season would be too obvious, but here it is anyway. I was ecstatic that K was willing to do it, and a little surprised, frankly. On that side of the ball I'm more optimistic moving forward than I've been in years.

 

[IPSYCHOSIS]

I rewatched the MSU game and Im confused