Height Measurements Nike Summit .. Interesting - Duke players, et al

[youngman42]

Always a bit of a controversy (shoes or no shoes?) - the important factor is getting appropriate relative height as well as wing span and reach to get a good idea about a player's actual size (e.g., If one kid is 6'9 in socks and another is 6'8.75 in shoes - there is likely a 2 inch difference between the two).

Two classics: Kevin Love is actually 6'7.75 in socks (Same height as former Wolves teammate Derrick Williams) and Dwight Howard is 6'9.

These are heights in shoes. On average, take 1.5 inches off the height in shoes for the real height, if that is of interest.

Interesting that Swanigan measured only 6'7.75 in shoes (which means he's basically 6'6).

Duke's two players measured 6'10 and 6'5 in shoes. Last year - Winslow was 6'6 in shoes; Okafor 6'10.75 and Tyus 6'1.25

What was quite interesting to me about Chase Jeter however is that his "Standing Reach" was 9'2.5'' which was the second highest reach to only Thon Maker (9'3). That's pretty impressive.



Height in Shoes

 

[acc hoops]

Most intestesting stat is they are listing Jeter at 239 pounds.
ESPN had him at 215 in January and other sites showed him at 220.
At 239 he is capable of playing the 5 .

 

[dukehokie]

I like to see height vs. standing reach. Swanigan for instance is 6'7 ish, but his standing reach 9'1. That is some damn impressive length. It's no wonder some of those near miss rebounds go his way versus other taller players. If you have position, you get the board. The same goes for getting hands in passing lanes and getting layups over taller players. Ingram is another with very impressive reach.

The shoes thing is whatever to me. They play in shoes. Meh. Height is fun for fan debate and lineup cards. Give me the standing reach stat and standing vert any day of the week.

Ben Simmons has some of the shortest arms in the game based on ratio. Interesting to see if that affects him in college at all.
This post was edited on 4/12 7:01 PM by dukehokie

 

[youngman42]

Originally posted by dukehokie:
I like to see height vs. standing reach. Swanigan for instance is 6'7 ish, but his standing reach 9'1. That is some damn impressive length. It's no wonder some of those near miss rebounds go his way versus other taller players. If you have position, you get the board. The same goes for getting hands in passing lanes and getting layups over taller players. Ingram is another with very impressive reach.

The shoes thing is whatever to me. They play in shoes. Meh. Height is fun for fan debate and lineup cards. Give me the standing reach stat and standing vert any day of the week.

Ben Simmons has some of the shortest arms in the game based on ratio. Interesting to see if that affects him in college at all.
This post was edited on 4/12 7:01 PM by dukehokie

On the one hand it doesn't matter about the shoes/socks. On the other it does have a small impact if you're measuring one player (say, in the NBA) based on socks, and another based on shoes. But, NBA players get measured by teams so they should know.

 

[youngman42]

Originally posted by acc hoops:
Most intestesting stat is they are listing Jeter at 239 pounds.
ESPN had him at 215 in January and other sites showed him at 220.
At 239 he is capable of playing the 5 .

I agree, I meant to mention that. It was pretty impressive. Shows he's getting stronger and tougher. I don't see Jeter as a one and done at this point (though a great year will surely put him there). But, could really see him develop and round up around 250+ by year two, if he's at 240 right now (which is pretty solid).

I am looking forward to him next year.

 

[dukehokie]

Originally posted by youngman42:

Originally posted by dukehokie:
I like to see height vs. standing reach. Swanigan for instance is 6'7 ish, but his standing reach 9'1. That is some damn impressive length. It's no wonder some of those near miss rebounds go his way versus other taller players. If you have position, you get the board. The same goes for getting hands in passing lanes and getting layups over taller players. Ingram is another with very impressive reach.

The shoes thing is whatever to me. They play in shoes. Meh. Height is fun for fan debate and lineup cards. Give me the standing reach stat and standing vert any day of the week.

Ben Simmons has some of the shortest arms in the game based on ratio. Interesting to see if that affects him in college at all.

This post was edited on 4/12 7:01 PM by dukehokie

On the one hand it doesn't matter about the shoes/socks. On the other it does have a small impact if you're measuring one player (say, in the NBA) based on socks, and another based on shoes. But, NBA players get measured by teams so they should know.



Very true. Without shoes is definitely most consistent.

 

[aah555]

Jeter, at this point, definitely looks like a multi-year guy. Although he does have sufficient size and athleticism to play the 5, really not sure what we can expect from him next season. I would guess that Jeter serves as Marshall's backup based on what I've seen on the all star game circuit.

This post was edited on 4/13 9:18 AM by aah555

 

[DukeDenver]

We could really use a true wing and potentially a ball handler. Neither would need to be an offensive stud to be effective with what we have already.

 

[aah555]

Originally posted by DukeDenver:
We could really use a true wing and potentially a ball handler. Neither would need to be an offensive stud to be effective with what we have already.

It really is unfortunate, in retrospect, that Semi left. He's precisely the type of physical force that we could use on the wing next year to play the 3/4. While I can certainly understand why he left -- at the time, it seemed possible, if not likely, that both Sheed and Winslow would be back, its likely that he would have played a rather large role on next year's team if he had stayed.

A PG really is a must if Tyus leaves. Although we could probably get away with Grayson as the backup PG for 5-10 minutes a night, it would be a major problem if we leaned on him to be the primary PG. It would be a lot like 04-05, where we had a decent team but ultimately got eliminated by MSU in the tourney b/c none of our guards handled the ball well enough to withstand their ball pressure.

This post was edited on 4/13 10:08 AM by aah555

 

[Crank_it_loud]

Will be pretty surprised if Chase doesn't start at some point next year....

 

[youngman42]

Originally posted by aah555:

Originally posted by DukeDenver:
We could really use a true wing and potentially a ball handler. Neither would need to be an offensive stud to be effective with what we have already.

It really is unfortunate, in retrospect, that Semi left. He's precisely the type of physical force that we could use on the wing next year to play the 3/4. While I can certainly understand why he left -- at the time, it seemed possible, if not likely, that both Sheed and Winslow would be back, its likely that he would have played a rather large role on next year's team if he had stayed.

A PG really is a must if Tyus leaves. Although we could probably get away with Grayson as the backup PG for 5-10 minutes a night, it would be a major problem if we leaned on him to be the primary PG. It would be a lot like 04-05, where we had a decent team but ultimately got eliminated by MSU in the tourney b/c none of our guards handled the ball well enough to withstand their ball pressure.

This post was edited on 4/13 10:08 AM by aah555

Agree on Semi. May have been better for him to wait to the end of the season and see what happened. Of course, he had so many others getting time as well - with Sheed still on the team.

Even still, it may be that his game just wasn't suited for Duke. He's sort of a tweener - he has great strength but is not a great outside shooter, not super quick defensively, and he's not big enough to have an impact inside. He probably needed to go to a mid-major to get PT and develop over 4 seasons. It's hard to develop a game at a top 10 program that is signing 2-3 big time recruits every year. But, he's a class kid, and I really wish him the best.

At PG - from what I've seen I think Kennard has better ball handling skills than Grayson. Grayson is a pure 2G, imo. I think he'll start at the 2 next year given the way he picked up on his defensive intensity.

 

[stanleyduke]

I still don't get the fascination with Semi. Did you watch him play? He never played physical and just hung around the three point line on offense and chucked it as soon as someone passed him the ball. Thats not what we needed from him. Sure he could have developed but he was definitely a project for a Duke caliber program. I remember watching his recruiting highlights and thinking this guy can't dribble on his highlight film and is taking too many jump shots against 5-8 150 lb Kansas kids, why did we recruit him?

 

[youngman42]

Interesting that 24/7 in its recruiting expert polls, has Brandon Ingram as a 68% favorite to land at Duke.

That would certain help with the wing slot, but Ingram is listed in the Rivals recruiting as 6'7, 200. However apparently he has grown. Look at these measurements from the Nike Summit. That kind of length would be huge for us at the 3:


Brandon Ingram, Undecided[/B]
247Sports Composite Rank: 12[/I]
Height (w/shoes): 6-9.5
Weight: 196
Wingspan: 7-3
Standing Reach: 9-1.5
Chase Jeter, Duke[/B]
247Sports Composite Rank: 10[/I]
Height (w/shoes): 6-10
Weight: 239
Wingspan: 7-1.5
Standing Reach: 9-2.5

 

[dukiejay]

Jeter has really bulked up. Last year at this time I think he was about 220. People forget he's actually young for his class....he could be a junior in high school this year.

We'll see on Ingram. I think he "wants" to go to UNC but isn't convinced it's the best fit for him. Tokoto moving on might open things up a little more for him. But still, I'm not sure I see more than 15-20 minutes per night there.

 

[Jake1985]

Ingram's game is not going to be based on weight or strength but he is gaining strength. There was a recent article that stated he will probably enter college at 200-205 range. It's his length and wing spand that "could" make him valuable defending the wing as well as scoring or shooting over smaller players. Ingram has the skills NBA teams are looking for and every NBA team (and college program) know they will add srrengtg and weight on him. He is an elite scorer that in these All-Star games and shined offensively but he has also shown his willingness to battle for rebounds and alter shots. I'm not sure why people would not want him based on weight. Amile is a fan favorite and a captain and when he arrived at Duke he played the 5 weighing 10lbs more than Ingram.

 

[aah555]

Originally posted by Jake1985:
Ingram's game is not going to be based on weight or strength but he is gaining strength. There was a recent article that stated he will probably enter college at 200-205 range. It's his length and wing spand that "could" make him valuable defending the wing as well as scoring or shooting over smaller players. Ingram has the skills NBA teams are looking for and every NBA team (and college program) know they will add srrengtg and weight on him. He is an elite scorer that in these All-Star games and shined offensively but he has also shown his willingness to battle for rebounds and alter shots. I'm not sure why people would not want him based on weight. Amile is a fan favorite and a captain and when he arrived at Duke he played the 5 weighing 10lbs more than Ingram.

(1) I don't know anyone who doesn't want Ingram based on weight. I would certainly like to have him in view of the rest of the roster. However, I do think he's a kid whose long term NBA potential may be a lot higher than his production-level next season, and will often be a major defensive liability. Ingram will certainly gain weight. But, in all likelihood, that weight gain will only come about after he's in the NBA. I do think Ingram's relative lack of strength has been partly masked by the fact that guys aren't necessarily playing that physically in these all-star settings and Ingram's going against a bunch of similarly-aged kids who aren't necessarily all that physical themselves. There's a huge difference between the guys he's been facing the last couple weeks and the type of PFs you see at the higher-end of college basketball (e.g., in our last 3 games, Wlitjer / Sabonis of Gonzaga, Dawson of MSU, and Nigel Hayes of Wisconsin).

(2) Amile didn't play the 5 (at least more than a handful of minutes at the 5) as a freshman. Mason Plumlee was the 5 (with Ryan Kelly the backup when he was healthy). Also, even as a 4, Amile got pushed around a lot. I still remember the game where NC State fouled Amile out in 10 or so minutes. I don't think anyone would suggest that Amile at the 5 (even as a soph.) worked out well at all, and it wasn't an accident that we often had Jabari defending the other team's 5. While I think Ingram could certainly survive at the 4 against some teams, there are some nights where that's not going to be a tenable position and that will ultimately end up putting a lot of pressure on Marshall and / or Chase Jeter to control the glass (maybe more pressure than they can handle).

This post was edited on 4/13 1:52 PM by aah555

 

[nptb]

Originally posted by youngman42:

Originally posted by aah555:

Originally posted by DukeDenver:
We could really use a true wing and potentially a ball handler. Neither would need to be an offensive stud to be effective with what we have already.

It really is unfortunate, in retrospect, that Semi left. He's precisely the type of physical force that we could use on the wing next year to play the 3/4. While I can certainly understand why he left -- at the time, it seemed possible, if not likely, that both Sheed and Winslow would be back, its likely that he would have played a rather large role on next year's team if he had stayed.

A PG really is a must if Tyus leaves. Although we could probably get away with Grayson as the backup PG for 5-10 minutes a night, it would be a major problem if we leaned on him to be the primary PG. It would be a lot like 04-05, where we had a decent team but ultimately got eliminated by MSU in the tourney b/c none of our guards handled the ball well enough to withstand their ball pressure.

This post was edited on 4/13 10:08 AM by aah555

Agree on Semi. May have been better for him to wait to the end of the season and see what happened. Of course, he had so many others getting time as well - with Sheed still on the team.

Even still, it may be that his game just wasn't suited for Duke. He's sort of a tweener - he has great strength but is not a great outside shooter, not super quick defensively, and he's not big enough to have an impact inside. He probably needed to go to a mid-major to get PT and develop over 4 seasons. It's hard to develop a game at a top 10 program that is signing 2-3 big time recruits every year. But, he's a class kid, and I really wish him the best.

At PG - from what I've seen I think Kennard has better ball handling skills than Grayson. Grayson is a pure 2G, imo. I think he'll start at the 2 next year given the way he picked up on his defensive intensity.

Kennard can without a doubt run the point. His game is exactly like D'Angelo Russell that was at Ohio St, but Kennard is a better shooter.