Amile

[dukiejay]

My Dream Team
1. DT (could be Frank eventually, but I don't expect Frank to come in and be Tyus Stones)
2. Grayson (I expect him to leave, but thats why this is my dream team)
3. Tatum Duh
4. Giles Duh
5. Bolden (has a higher ceiling than Amile, ride him while he's not, play Amile when he's not

Just remember.....the ceiling is only one year.

I'm kind of with aah on this one. Bolden is a fantastic prospect but he's hardly a proven commodity at the collegiate level. Tatum and Giles have high ceilings. They're almost sure-fire stars from day one. Being able to play alongside a 5th year senior who is a proven leader, a captain, great post defender and someone who doesn't demand touches is much more attractive to me personally.

Rolling out a basketball and saying "here go play" to four freshman doesn't have a great track record attached to it. I think we forget the importance of guys named Quinn Cook, Matt Jones and Amile Jefferson buying in last year. That's an important trait too. And just because it worked recently doesn't mean it can work again.

Don't take this to mean I don't want Bolden, because I do. But if it's my pick to take the proven 5th year senior over the freshman, unless he's a Okafor-type talent, the senior is going to win out almost every time.

 

[pisgah101]

Boy, I hope you are right.. How about your % on landing Bolden?
OFC

Depends on Amile. He comes back it's be really low if he doesn't come back I'd say we are the "favorite" depending on who all leaves UK

 

[baseballlover14]

But say Amile and those guys come back from uk as well. Then who does he picked because uk will still have more depth than us and

 

[DukeRulesBasketball]

Depends on Amile. He comes back it's be really low if he doesn't come back I'd say we are the "favorite" depending on who all leaves UK

This might sound like a silly question, but how come Bolden can't share minutes with Amile? It worked with Tyus and Quinn in the backcourt and we know how well it worked out.

 

[pisgah101]

This might sound like a silly question, but how come Bolden can't share minutes with Amile? It worked with Tyus and Quinn in the backcourt and we know how well it worked out.

In another thread someone was quoted from another site saying one of two things would happen: Amile red shirts and comes back OR Bolden comes but they said both wouldn't happen. Idk if that's gospel or not but what I heard

As for UK if everyone came back and Amile did I kinda think it would be up in the air. I guess it could work with him being here with Amile and Giles starting and bolden playing backup C when Amile rest or Amile sliding down to PF when Harry sits and bolden playing C.. Also I think Chase will make a jump and earn PT but if Amile comes back he'll get 30+ IMO and Harry will as well so idk if Bolden will see it as time to go around

 

[twdukefan]

But say Amile and those guys come back from uk as well. Then who does he picked because uk will still have more depth than us and

TCU haha

 

[DukeRulesBasketball]

In another thread someone was quoted from another site saying one of two things would happen: Amile red shirts and comes back OR Bolden comes but they said both wouldn't happen. Idk if that's gospel or not but what I heard

As for UK if everyone came back and Amile did I kinda think it would be up in the air. I guess it could work with him being here with Amile and Giles starting and bolden playing backup C when Amile rest or Amile sliding down to PF when Harry sits and bolden playing C.. Also I think Chase will make a jump and earn PT but if Amile comes back he'll get 30+ IMO and Harry will as well so idk if Bolden will see it as time to go around

Thanks for the insight Pisgah. I appreciate it. The thought of Bolden sharing minutes with Amile just occurred to me when I posed that question.

 

[Get Nasty]

I think bolden is closer to okafor than jeter. I believe people forget what teams amile was having double doubles against early this season. To me amile is a 6th man on good great teams like last year.

As for pg i do believe frank is a college 2 but nba pg, steve francis westbrook type. With that said i think he might be that much better than Thornton to play more than him. Thornton and matt off the bench and possibly luke and amile depending on who comes and stays is insane.

 

[Crank_it_loud]

Thornton is starting at the point next year, and will get a majority of the minutes....

 

[Get Nasty]

Thornton is starting at the point next year, and will get a majority of the minutes....

Grayson gone?

 

[Dattier]

Bolden is a center. He plays the 5. Jefferson is at best a 4 and sometimes a 3. He cannot play effectively at the 5 except in certain cases.

If Amile comes back, I suspect he'll be in and out of the starting lineup. But, will mainly be off the bench if we also land Bolden. But, that's okay. At 3 front line spots there is always room for a guy off the bench.

What happens with other guys - Jeter and Obi - if Jefferson comes back, that's a different story.

In that "Great Centers" thread you're disqualifying Booz, Shelden, and almost Brand b/c they're actually 4s despite having played the 5 exclusively -- and well -- at Duke. Forgive me if I suggest you may have a blind spot regarding the way college positions have often worked out here. Amile has played the 5 here, and would continue to sometimes when he returns either this year or next.

For that matter, Harry Giles will probably play some 5 next year, too. Shoot, Kyle Singler did, and he was smaller and had skills outside the post (which were not inhibited). Those of us old enough to eat cornbread w/o choking should know that just like the "Best 5" (on-court line-up) isn't necessarily the "5 Best" (individual players), the default center for us is often going to be the best player available, not the best center available.

I'll take the return of Amile -- a known and loved commodity... the bird in hand... a mature leader, player, and teammate -- over a single season from Bolden who plays well enough to potential his way into the lottery. W/ either one, I'd expect a 3-man post rotation (unequal minutes) of Harry, Chase, and Amile/Bolden w/ Javin and maybe finally Obi picking up scraps. If we were unthinkably blessed to have both Amile and Bolden, we'd have a 4-man post rotation w/ either Chase or Bolden distinguishing himself as the 3rd as the season went along.

 

[Baller224]

Completely. But it's not inside info per say but I'm completely 100%

I completely agree, Grayson isn't leaving.

 

[Get Nasty]

Anyone know if Grayson is working towards a degree in 3?

 

[dukiejay]

Anyone know if Grayson is working towards a degree in 3?

That's the plan.

 

[Crank_it_loud]

Grayson gone?

Has little to do with Grayson. Have you watched Duke this year?

 

[jwill133]

I would only be happy "punting" this season if we have Amile and Bolden on our roster next year.
Any chance Amile plays tomorrow?

 

[dopeshop23]

can Bolden and Amile share time sure... but will greatly depend on how well and quickly he (Bolden) picks up on defensive principles. We won't have too much trouble scoring the ball next year.

 

[Get Nasty]

Has little to do with Grayson. Have you watched Duke this year?

That's exactly why I don't think thornton is the best answer if he starts. I get it that duke needs a true pg, but i haven't seen anything consistent to make me believe that thornton is anywhere near the level we need from our PG. We need him now because matt, luke, and grayson are not close to PGs and can't guard pgs. Jackson to me is a combo guard with more ability than those 3 to play some PG. I hope Thornton plays well the end of this season and that helps spring board him into making huge strides in the off season.

 

[Crank_it_loud]

DT has already made big strides imo. An off-season will do wonders for him, and I'd rather have him running things vs Allen, who rarely runs the point this year. The good news is there should be options, but I think DT will be very good next year.

 

[Get Nasty]

Hope you're right. I'm just super excited to watch Jackson and think he has lottery pick potential.

 

[WI#1Dukie22]

People folding on DT is just FING MIND BOGGLING!!!! DT WILL prove MANY wrong. Love that kid!!!! Criticizing some game play, no problem... Counting him out as a "Duke level Pg" next season ....BULLS$&T

 

[duke198025]

DT already shows more potential than Dockery and Paulus ever did. I wonder what the threads were like when they were manning the point.

He hasn't been great, but he's lighting quick and can play D, which is more than you can say about the last several PGs at Duke. I think he'll grow as a distributor as the talent around him increases greatly next year.

 

[Get Nasty]

I'm not counting him out, i just haven't seen any signs that he's a "Championship level duke pg". I knew his shot needed work, but i expected his driving ability and passing ability to be much further along.

Duke is just bringing in a player that I think might be an absolute stud, and if grayson stays, the pg is the next logical spot for him to take minutes from.
Our pgs winning championships
Hurley
Williams
Scheyer
Jones

We haven't won without great PG play. Scheyer wasn't duke's typical pg(not that duke has a typical pg), but he was so smart and made so many crucial plays, and ran the show similar to tyus. His size was also a huge advantage.

 

[Get Nasty]

DT already shows more potential than Dockery and Paulus ever did. I wonder what the threads were like when they were manning the point.

He hasn't been great, but he's lighting quick and can play D, which is more than you can say about the last several PGs at Duke. I think he'll grow as a distributor as the talent around him increases greatly next year.

They were not good, as one would expect. Thornton has more physical ability than them for sure, but he's got much further to go than I expected.

 

[duke198025]

They were not good, as one would expect. Thornton has more physical ability than them for sure, but he's got much further to go than I expected.

The biggest area he needs to improve is in distribution, which I think he will. If he can do that and play air tight D then he'll be golden. He doesn't and won't be called on to carry the scoring burden with the pieces around him next year.

 

[Jake1985]

I have one very good connection in Texas and that person flat out said that Bolden is not concerned about Amile red shirting or competing bc the kid is very confident about his ability to play the 5. But if he's going to a team that is going to be log jammed in the front line that he would prob go to Kentucky. The guy said Bolden is very torn bc he really likes Kentucky and Cal but sees a lot of big guys there and Bolden could see him self at Duke bc of the need for a quality 5. BUT if the decision was only based on Bolden and what would be his perfect world then he would choose Kentucky.

 

[TWARedRaider01]

If Skal comes back with the incoming freshman I think Bolden would be a bit foolish to go but thats me.

 

[timo0402]

The biggest area he needs to improve is in distribution, which I think he will. If he can do that and play air tight D then he'll be golden. He doesn't and won't be called on to carry the scoring burden with the pieces around him next year.

His on the ball defense has been rather stealt to say the least. He's only going to get better, and his assist numbers will go up next year where the offense isn't a spread the court and either Grayson or Brandon go one on one. He absolutely makes some bad decisions but he's also a freshman that didn't have an off season. With a full one this year coupled with the invaluable experience he's gained, I expect a huge jump, which isn't rare, from frosh to soph year. I'd be stunned if he isn't the starting pg all year next year, which he was recruited to be btw from the start of his recruitment.

 

[pisgah101]

DT already shows more potential than Dockery and Paulus ever did. I wonder what the threads were like when they were manning the point.

He hasn't been great, but he's lighting quick and can play D, which is more than you can say about the last several PGs at Duke. I think he'll grow as a distributor as the talent around him increases greatly next year.

I disagree.. Paulus' freshman season he averaged a little over 5 assist a game, of course he was dishing it to JJ and Sheldon but as a freshman that showed a lot of potential. As a sophomore he developed a great three point shot and was around 45% from 3, his assists went down but the talent he played with dropped dramatically.. As a junior we had a great freshman class and a great sophomore class returning and talent was surrounding him even tho it was young talent but he failed to ever grow as a player. His assists didn't jump and his shooting suffered some.. His senior year the wheels fell off and he was pretty much awful.. So has IMO paulus showed more his freshman season but didn't pan out

 

[dukiejay]

Timo pretty much nailed it, but by the time he posted it I had wasted enough time typing my response for it to just be wasted.

Duke hasn't run the kind of set offense this season they'd like because 1) Thornton is a freshman and needs a little time to adjust, and 2) because Allen and Ingram are great players who work better with the ball in their hands, the floor spread and creating for themselves.

People folding on DT is just FING MIND BOGGLING!!!! DT WILL prove MANY wrong. Love that kid!!!! Criticizing some game play, no problem... Counting him out as a "Duke level Pg" next season ....BULLS$&T

It's a bit of the old Florence Nightingale effect....you fall in love with the unknowns. My guess is that few people on this board have seen Jackson or Bolden play. But they've heard about how great they will be so they completely buy in. With guys like Derryck and Amile they've seen the kind of players they are and assume it's who they will always be. They can't envision what they've saw to get better....but what they haven't seen? Well, that guy is a complete stud.

And know I'm speaking in generalities here. It's not that way for everyone. But just in the last 10 years on this board I've seen how Boykin, Boateng, T. King, a freshman Nolan, Quinn, Amile, Hairston --- and the list is much longer --- should all be playing before the guy in front of them. Don't forget, this board was begging for no more Quinn Cook just two years ago. BEGGING!!! Think about that.

People aren't handing out an A-grade to Derryck, they're not saying Amile is an All-American. But I think people are kidding themselves if they don't put value in how big of strides a Derryck Thornton can take by next season, or by how valuable having a senior captain, best post defender and leader like Amile can be. I find it absolutely mind-blowing.

 

[TWARedRaider01]

Lets remember Thornton should be in high school right now and got to duke late and didnt really have the summer to work with the team. If he didnt come to Duke this year we would have really been hurting.

 

[dukiejay]

I disagree.. Paulus' freshman season he averaged a little over 5 assist a game, of course he was dishing it to JJ and Sheldon but as a freshman that showed a lot of potential. As a sophomore he developed a great three point shot and was around 45% from 3, his assists went down but the talent he played with dropped dramatically.. As a junior we had a great freshman class and a great sophomore class returning and talent was surrounding him even tho it was young talent but he failed to ever grow as a player. His assists didn't jump and his shooting suffered some.. His senior year the wheels fell off and he was pretty much awful.. So has IMO paulus showed more his freshman season but didn't pan out

Greg's career was an odd one to say the least. There are a lot of things out there from some solid sources that suggest he wasn't always the best teammate or the nicest guy. So much so that he had a complete falling out with Duke altogether. No matter the player, I hate to hear things like that. But it happens everywhere.

As for Greg's career, the 2007-09 stretch --- his sophomore, junior and senior years --- was probably the worst stretch we as Duke fans have witnessed under K. Maybe '95-'97 rivals it because '95 was so bad. But anyway, there wasn't an abundance of perceived talent on those clubs...and the talent that was there were kids who were young but would eventually mold themselves in national champions. But Zoubek and Lance weren't the Zoubek and Lance we saw in 2010. We severaly lacked key parts. It's not Greg's fault he was in an offense that often featured Kyle Singler playing the five.

 

[Laettner15]

I have one very good connection in Texas and that person flat out said that Bolden is not concerned about Amile red shirting or competing bc the kid is very confident about his ability to play the 5. But if he's going to a team that is going to be log jammed in the front line that he would prob go to Kentucky. The guy said Bolden is very torn bc he really likes Kentucky and Cal but sees a lot of big guys there and Bolden could see him self at Duke bc of the need for a quality 5. BUT if the decision was only based on Bolden and what would be his perfect world then he would choose Kentucky.

As always thanks for providing that insight Jake1985! Sorry fellas for posting that tweet... I should know better then to listen to rumors on Twitter haha

 

[Get Nasty]

Timo pretty much nailed it, but by the time he posted it I had wasted enough time typing my response for it to just be wasted.

Duke hasn't run the kind of set offense this season they'd like because 1) Thornton is a freshman and needs a little time to adjust, and 2) because Allen and Ingram are great players who work better with the ball in their hands, the floor spread and creating for themselves.



It's a bit of the old Florence Nightingale effect....you fall in love with the unknowns. My guess is that few people on this board have seen Jackson or Bolden play. But they've heard about how great they will be so they completely buy in. With guys like Derryck and Amile they've seen the kind of players they are and assume it's who they will always be. They can't envision what they've saw to get better....but what they haven't seen? Well, that guy is a complete stud.

And know I'm speaking in generalities here. It's not that way for everyone. But just in the last 10 years on this board I've seen how Boykin, Boateng, T. King, a freshman Nolan, Quinn, Amile, Hairston --- and the list is much longer --- should all be playing before the guy in front of them. Don't forget, this board was begging for no more Quinn Cook just two years ago. BEGGING!!! Think about that.

People aren't handing out an A-grade to Derryck, they're not saying Amile is an All-American. But I think people are kidding themselves if they don't put value in how big of strides a Derryck Thornton can take by next season, or by how valuable having a senior captain, best post defender and leader like Amile can be. I find it absolutely mind-blowing.

I agree and hope Derryck makes huge strides, but I also hope Jackson does the same. At this point in time, I think right now as a sr in HS Jackson is better than Derryck, with that said, Derryck will have the advantage of 1 year of play in the ACC under his belt, and that is huge. I just have super high expectations for jackson. Could be setting myself up for a let down. I'm more excited for Jackson than Giles because of Giles injury (if he comes back 100% then i'll be giddy).

As for Amile, I don't think anyone here doesn't want Amile, just the opposite. We do have 2nd time captain in sr matt jones, and possibly grayson back (could see him as captain as well). The question was posed though if mutually exclusive would you have amile or bolden? Tough one for sure for me. I take Bolden for 2 reasons, 1 his talent/upsdie, 2 we have a huge post presence in case of giles not coming back completely healthy. Yes Bolden is the bigger question and probably has much more variance, but i think gives us the best chance if he is what people think he can be to help duke win a championship.

 

[crazyduke3]

I don't think anybody should be shocked if frank starts a few games. Nobody is counting DT off this team so chill.

Greg I'm always thankful for. He took so much crap and played so hard for us. No, it didn't end in a fairy tale but he tried his best.

 

[Get Nasty]

I like good problems

 

[crazyduke3]

Jake hope you've been doing good buddy love seeing you around!

 

[jwill133]

Everyone remember, Tyus was supposed to be the starting PG for this 2016 Duke team.
I think it was obvious from November (the UK game mainly) that DT was far behind in terms of what a starting PG should be doing each play. I specifically remember the UK game, they got like 5 straight easy buckets because DT was not getting back on defense after his turnover or someone's bad shot.
With that said, he show's flashes of brilliance each game. He is lightning quick and some of his finishes around the basket you just can't teach. (Paulus could never finish like DT).

I think a FULL SUMMER in the Duke offseason program will do a whole lot for DT's game and he will be our starting PG on day 1 next year. He will have alot of competition with Frank obviously, but DT is definitely the more "natural PG."

Next year's team will be so loaded, we don't need our PG to be one of our leading scorers. We need our PG to take care of the ball and get others in position to take high % shots. I believe DT is the man for that job.

 

[pisgah101]

I wish Tyus was here

 

[adm015]

It is ashamed that we have to pick between Jefferson and Bolden. I think Coach K should play more than 7-8 players per game and by doing that it will allow Giles, Jefferson and Bolden to all get good minutes. I don't think Giles will be 100% until ACC play so I would only play him about 20 minutes a game at the beginning that leaves Jefferson being able to play the PF with Bolden starting at C. As the year progresses make the necessary changes needed to win games. But we can have both players if Coach K calls Bolden and says, "You will get plenty of playing time"