The New Lounge

[Dattier]

The article is from the conservative Cato Institute offering valid criticism of presidential rankings, as I said.

I did a little deeper digging. (Don't worry; it was fun.) There's a link in the article to the rankings themselves.
Here are some numbers:
* Conservatives and liberals agree on 7 of the top 10, 18 of the top 20, and all of the bottom 7, in some order.
* 32 of the 45 (remember, Grover Cleveland counts twice as both the 22nd and 24th President) were ranked within 3 spots of each other, from conservatives to liberals.
* More recent Presidents had the biggest disparity in ranking from one group to the next. In reverse order, with the difference in parentheses: Biden (17), Trump (just 2), Obama (7), GW Bush (14), Clinton (just 2, but w/ conservatives ranking him better!), GHW Bush (11), Reagan (12), Carter (just 1, w/ both in the top 20!), Ford (just 3), Nixon (6), LBJ (5).
* From LBJ, you have to skip the four before him back to Hoover, and right before him, Coolidge, to get a difference greater than 3 (6 each).
* From Coolidge -- the 30th President -- you have to go all the way back to Garfield -- the 20th President -- to find the next difference higher than three (9).
* Of the first 19 Presidents, only Grant at #18 was higher than 4 (6), and only Van Buren at #8 and Jackson at #7 were as high as that.

A few observations, then...
* It would be easy to conclude that we're living in more polarized times than any time in US history at least since the Civil War. I tend to agree, but not because of these numbers. I'm guessing it's more due to how things settle over time. Like, 50 years from now, those same discrepancies probably will have shrunk some. GW Bush has already risen from last place among liberals at the time he left office to 32nd. I suspect he might climb another spot or 3, and he may drop a few from 18th for conservatives. Truman went from pretty unpopular at the time he left office to top 10. Wilson has dropped from the top 10 to 15th or 16th and I suspect he will continue to drop sharply. Neither Eisenhower nor LBJ were anywhere near the top 10 when I was a kid.
* Y'all are speaking from emotion and recency bias when you claim Biden is the worst ever ever ever by far, and that Obama is the next worst ever ever ever by far. Conservative scholars -- scholars, mind you, not message board keyboard warriors and social media blowhards -- rank Biden 30th, 13 spots above where they themselves rank Trump. (I'm not sure where I would rank Biden, but I suspect it would be closer to 30th than the 13th liberals have him at in this study.)
* You can disagree with any or all of these rankings. I certainly disagree with many. You're a hypocrite and an idiot to question the integrity of the people participating and compiling them... when all you do is trot out your spoon-fed rightwing talking points about mainstream media and socialist educators. Show your receipts or shut up or just keep announcing your idiocy to the world as is. If this were a proverbial d***-measuring contest, they just lay their junk out on the table while you cover your crotches in shame and back away claiming you're bigger. Show. Your. Work. (Proverbially).

 

[KDSTONE]

K-12 public schools an ivory tower? lol

As an educator with more than 28 years of experience, I've sent students to universities, community colleges, trade schools, the military, job programs, the job market, the arts, etc. I've long recognized and respected different forms of intelligence and that one-size does not fit all. I'm not at all exceptional in this regard when it comes to public school educators. We know how messed up standardized testing is. We know there's an appalling lack of vocational ed. We know and respect that a 4-year university education isn't for everyone.

I'm the last person here who would claim my multiple degrees are a sign of my intelligence. My perseverance, grit, and certain knowledge, certainly, but not my intelligence. And I'm confident of the intelligence I have while aware of its limits.

Ironically, it's conservatives intimidated by educational institutions who lack respect for different forms of intelligence. You inherently distrust and fear academic intelligence and therefore disrespect and insult it as a means of bringing it down to your level.

Teaching critical thinking is what leads to questioning the status quo, not indoctrination. Teach someone critical thinking skills and they stop obeying blindly. That's why conservative parents hate public school and that's why conservatives hate and fear academia.

You’re on a message board. This ain’t a job interview

 

[Dattier]

Jesus, Datt. It’s just a random tweet. Not a source. Lol.

JD Vance is weird .

Source:

View embedded media

It's the only "source" you ever bring.

Gov Walz is a goofball dad. Sen Vance doesn't understand how to order donuts.

 

[Dattier]

I skipped most of that, but I caught the last paragraph. You’re absolutely right. If there’s one thing our public schools are famous for, it’s teaching critical thinking skills. Are you high?

You really ought to spend more time defending yourself for admitting the bold. I would say that standardized testing and political interference impedes how well we teach critical thinking skills, but that's the goal, yes. (Don't both sides of the political aisle agree that standardized testing has damaged schools?) If instead of teaching your children critical thinking you're instead teaching them that what you say goes, and it's your way or the highway, and that as long as you're under my roof yada yada yada, and that in this family we believe yada yada yada, than any critical thinking they pick up in school is going to feel like a threat to your puny mind.

 

[KDSTONE]

I did a little deeper digging. (Don't worry; it was fun.) There's a link in the article to the rankings themselves.
Here are some numbers:
* Conservatives and liberals agree on 7 of the top 10, 18 of the top 20, and all of the bottom 7, in some order.
* 32 of the 45 (remember, Grover Cleveland counts twice as both the 22nd and 24th President) were ranked within 3 spots of each other, from conservatives to liberals.
* More recent Presidents had the biggest disparity in ranking from one group to the next. In reverse order, with the difference in parentheses: Biden (17), Trump (just 2), Obama (7), GW Bush (14), Clinton (just 2, but w/ conservatives ranking him better!), GHW Bush (11), Reagan (12), Carter (just 1, w/ both in the top 20!), Ford (just 3), Nixon (6), LBJ (5).
* From LBJ, you have to skip the four before him back to Hoover, and right before him, Coolidge, to get a difference greater than 3 (6 each).
* From Coolidge -- the 30th President -- you have to go all the way back to Garfield -- the 20th President -- to find the next difference higher than three (9).
* Of the first 19 Presidents, only Grant at #18 was higher than 4 (6), and only Van Buren at #8 and Jackson at #7 were as high as that.

A few observations, then...
* It would be easy to conclude that we're living in more polarized times than any time in US history at least since the Civil War. I tend to agree, but not because of these numbers. I'm guessing it's more due to how things settle over time. Like, 50 years from now, those same discrepancies probably will have shrunk some. GW Bush has already risen from last place among liberals at the time he left office to 32nd. I suspect he might climb another spot or 3, and he may drop a few from 18th for conservatives. Truman went from pretty unpopular at the time he left office to top 10. Wilson has dropped from the top 10 to 15th or 16th and I suspect he will continue to drop sharply. Neither Eisenhower nor LBJ were anywhere near the top 10 when I was a kid.
* Y'all are speaking from emotion and recency bias when you claim Biden is the worst ever ever ever by far, and that Obama is the next worst ever ever ever by far. Conservative scholars -- scholars, mind you, not message board keyboard warriors and social media blowhards -- rank Biden 30th, 13 spots above where they themselves rank Trump. (I'm not sure where I would rank Biden, but I suspect it would be closer to 30th than the 13th liberals have him at in this study.)
* You can disagree with any or all of these rankings. I certainly disagree with many. You're a hypocrite and an idiot to question the integrity of the people participating and compiling them... when all you do is trot out your spoon-fed rightwing talking points about mainstream media and socialist educators. Show your receipts or shut up or just keep announcing your idiocy to the world as is. If this were a proverbial d***-measuring contest, they just lay their junk out on the table while you cover your crotches in shame and back away claiming you're bigger. Show. Your. Work. (Proverbially).

Right. These “conservatives” are undoubtedly in the Liz Cheney/ Mitt Romney mold. You’re not fooling anyone with this nonsense. Here’s a goal for you today: try to go the rest of the day without calling anyone stupid. If you can’t, you may be due for another mental health break

 

[KDSTONE]

I did a little deeper digging. (Don't worry; it was fun.) There's a link in the article to the rankings themselves.
Here are some numbers:
* Conservatives and liberals agree on 7 of the top 10, 18 of the top 20, and all of the bottom 7, in some order.
* 32 of the 45 (remember, Grover Cleveland counts twice as both the 22nd and 24th President) were ranked within 3 spots of each other, from conservatives to liberals.
* More recent Presidents had the biggest disparity in ranking from one group to the next. In reverse order, with the difference in parentheses: Biden (17), Trump (just 2), Obama (7), GW Bush (14), Clinton (just 2, but w/ conservatives ranking him better!), GHW Bush (11), Reagan (12), Carter (just 1, w/ both in the top 20!), Ford (just 3), Nixon (6), LBJ (5).
* From LBJ, you have to skip the four before him back to Hoover, and right before him, Coolidge, to get a difference greater than 3 (6 each).
* From Coolidge -- the 30th President -- you have to go all the way back to Garfield -- the 20th President -- to find the next difference higher than three (9).
* Of the first 19 Presidents, only Grant at #18 was higher than 4 (6), and only Van Buren at #8 and Jackson at #7 were as high as that.

A few observations, then...
* It would be easy to conclude that we're living in more polarized times than any time in US history at least since the Civil War. I tend to agree, but not because of these numbers. I'm guessing it's more due to how things settle over time. Like, 50 years from now, those same discrepancies probably will have shrunk some. GW Bush has already risen from last place among liberals at the time he left office to 32nd. I suspect he might climb another spot or 3, and he may drop a few from 18th for conservatives. Truman went from pretty unpopular at the time he left office to top 10. Wilson has dropped from the top 10 to 15th or 16th and I suspect he will continue to drop sharply. Neither Eisenhower nor LBJ were anywhere near the top 10 when I was a kid.
* Y'all are speaking from emotion and recency bias when you claim Biden is the worst ever ever ever by far, and that Obama is the next worst ever ever ever by far. Conservative scholars -- scholars, mind you, not message board keyboard warriors and social media blowhards -- rank Biden 30th, 13 spots above where they themselves rank Trump. (I'm not sure where I would rank Biden, but I suspect it would be closer to 30th than the 13th liberals have him at in this study.)
* You can disagree with any or all of these rankings. I certainly disagree with many. You're a hypocrite and an idiot to question the integrity of the people participating and compiling them... when all you do is trot out your spoon-fed rightwing talking points about mainstream media and socialist educators. Show your receipts or shut up or just keep announcing your idiocy to the world as is. If this were a proverbial d***-measuring contest, they just lay their junk out on the table while you cover your crotches in shame and back away claiming you're bigger. Show. Your. Work. (Proverbially).

Truman’s in the top 10. He did what he thought was necessary at the time re Hiroshima and Nagasaki and he saved American lives no doubt. A lot of these same profs, however, likely accuse Israel of genocide and they put Truman in the top 10. You couldn’t make this sh up

 

[KDSTONE]

You really ought to spend more time defending yourself for admitting the bold. I would say that standardized testing and political interference impedes how well we teach critical thinking skills, but that's the goal, yes. (Don't both sides of the political aisle agree that standardized testing has damaged schools?) If instead of teaching your children critical thinking you're instead teaching them that what you say goes, and it's your way or the highway, and that as long as you're under my roof yada yada yada, and that in this family we believe yada yada yada, than any critical thinking they pick up in school is going to feel like a threat to your puny mind.

A lot of teachers hate standardized testing, because it holds them accountable. You know, it measures whether the students have actually learned what they were supposed to. Otherwise, you’re just taking the teacher’s word for it. No mystery why teachers hate it, but not for the bull sh reasons they give.

 

[KDSTONE]

You really ought to spend more time defending yourself for admitting the bold. I would say that standardized testing and political interference impedes how well we teach critical thinking skills, but that's the goal, yes. (Don't both sides of the political aisle agree that standardized testing has damaged schools?) If instead of teaching your children critical thinking you're instead teaching them that what you say goes, and it's your way or the highway, and that as long as you're under my roof yada yada yada, and that in this family we believe yada yada yada, than any critical thinking they pick up in school is going to feel like a threat to your puny mind.

So now we’re all bad fathers too? Your arrogance and condescension knows no bounds

 

[Dattier]

Right. These “conservatives” are undoubtedly in the Liz Cheney/ Mitt Romney mold. You’re not fooling anyone with this nonsense. Here’s a goal for you today: try to go the rest of the day without calling anyone stupid. If you can’t, you may be due for another mental health break

You just did exactly what I said you've been doing: sticking to your spoon-fed rightwing talking points w/o showsing any intellectual effort. To get me to stop saying you are stupid, stop being stupid. I've been very clear on how you can do that. It has nothing to do w/ having a different opinion.

They're conservative scholars, not conservative politicians or snowflakes. They aren't controlled by their emotions like y'all are here.

 

[Dattier]

So now we’re all bad fathers too? Your arrogance and condescension knows no bounds

Don't be so emotional. That's not what I said. If that's how it makes you feel, my sympathies, but I'm not taking responsibility for your emotions.

We're all imperfect fathers, including me. If you're scared of public schools indoctrinating your kids because of that specific reason, it is indeed one of your parental shortcomings, and what you're afraid of is allowing your kids to think for themselves, which is what critical thinking skills are for in the first place. If that's not you... if you're not the hit dog... don't bark. If it IS you... do better.

 

[Dattier]

A lot of teachers hate standardized testing, because it holds them accountable. You know, it measures whether the students have actually learned what they were supposed to. Otherwise, you’re just taking the teacher’s word for it. No mystery why teachers hate it, but not for the bull sh reasons they give.

What reasons would those be?
That the tests are often created without regard for regional knowledge like info on the beach or snow?
That the tests are created for profiting the companies that make them more so than for actual student learning?
That what a kid has done all year long in a variety of learning modes is a better indicator of what they know than a 3-hour session with a couple 2-minute breaks, no talking, no moving, no eating or drinking?
Who the heck do you think is the actual expert on what a kid knows in school if not the teacher?

Why do you think people go into teaching? Because we hate kids and want to do something easy? Are you really that stupid?

 

[Mac9192]

You just did exactly what I said you've been doing: sticking to your spoon-fed rightwing talking points w/o showsing any intellectual effort. To get me to stop saying you are stupid, stop being stupid. I've been very clear on how you can do that. It has nothing to do w/ having a different opinion.

They're conservative scholars, not conservative politicians or snowflakes. They aren't controlled by their emotions like y'all are here.

You have glimpses of showing good faith, then WHAM! back to the Datt we are sadly more used to. Your comment on "y'all" being controlled by emotion? This is really rich coming from you. If we're honest, aren't we all here controlled too much by emotion?

 

[Dattier]

Truman’s in the top 10. He did what he thought was necessary at the time re Hiroshima and Nagasaki and he saved American lives no doubt. A lot of these same profs, however, likely accuse Israel of genocide and they put Truman in the top 10. You couldn’t make this sh up

Irrelevant. The point is that Truman was not popular when he left office in 1953. Many scholars now disagree that he truly needed to drop the bombs, but his status in the top 10 is evidence that his decision is viewed within the context of the time he made it. Just like Washington and Jefferson get some leniency for owning slaves, Jackson gets some leniency for killing Native Americans, and FDR and LBJ get some leniency for social reforms that are still imperfect.

 

[Dattier]

You have glimpses of showing good faith, then WHAM! back to the Datt we are sadly more used to. Your comment on "y'all" being controlled by emotion? This is really rich coming from you. If we're honest, aren't we all here controlled too much by emotion?

What do you care? I'm not even a real American to you because I vote differently than you. Your words. You are one of the biggest bad faith actors here. Learn to police your extremist crap before trying to make me make any effort toward some common ground.

 

[Mac9192]

What do you care? I'm not even a real American to you because I vote differently than you. Your words. You are one of the biggest bad faith actors here. Learn to police your extremist crap before trying to make me make any effort toward some common ground.

Datt, Datt, Datt. I obviously care, or I wouldn't waste my time posting here. My comment really got to you. Good. That was the intent. You've been indoctrinated by the media. I used to be. Other than Trump, too many Republicans are gutless. The Democrats though are delusional and dangerous.

 

[KDSTONE]

So now we’re all bad fathers too? Your arrogance and condescension knows no bounds

What reasons would those be?
That the tests are often created without regard for regional knowledge like info on the beach or snow?
That the tests are created for profiting the companies that make them more so than for actual student learning?
That what a kid has done all year long in a variety of learning modes is a better indicator of what they know than a 3-hour session with a couple 2-minute breaks, no talking, no moving, no eating or drinking?
Who the heck do you think is the actual expert on what a kid knows in school if not the teacher?

Why do you think people go into teaching? Because we hate kids and want to do something easy? Are you really that stupid?

Many teachers can’t be objective because it’s in their own professional interest to claim that students have learned more than they have.
Why do people go into teaching? Good benefits? Three + months out of the year off?

 

[GhostOf301]

Another day, another class deprived of education because their teacher thinks he's owning the nazis on a college basketball message board.

 

[KDSTONE]

Don't be so emotional. That's not what I said. If that's how it makes you feel, my sympathies, but I'm not taking responsibility for your emotions.

We're all imperfect fathers, including me. If you're scared of public schools indoctrinating your kids because of that specific reason, it is indeed one of your parental shortcomings, and what you're afraid of is allowing your kids to think for themselves, which is what critical thinking skills are for in the first place. If that's not you... if you're not the hit dog... don't bark. If it IS you... do better.

Universities are echo chambers now and conservative students often complain about pressure to conform to their professor’s viewpoint. Like with free speech, critical thinking skills are championed until these skills lead to an unpopular conclusion. Then the harassment and name calling starts. Not unlike this message board

 

[KDSTONE]

Irrelevant. The point is that Truman was not popular when he left office in 1953. Many scholars now disagree that he truly needed to drop the bombs, but his status in the top 10 is evidence that his decision is viewed within the context of the time he made it. Just like Washington and Jefferson get some leniency for owning slaves, Jackson gets some leniency for killing Native Americans, and FDR and LBJ get some leniency for social reforms that are still imperfect.

All the Dems get leniency like Robert Byrd. Republicans not so much.

 

[GhostOf301]

Do we think Tampon Tim is setting the LGTBQA++ community back by pretending to be a heterosexual instead of embracing who he is?

 

[KDSTONE]

Do we think Tampon Tim is setting the LGTBQA++ community back by pretending to be a heterosexual instead of embracing who he is?

Look up beard in the dictionary and you’ll see a picture of his dingbat for a wife

 

[GhostOf301]

@SDevada look at my sources.

 

[smashmouth5]

 

[KDSTONE]

View embedded media

Probably getting Jan 6 and Oct 7 mixed up. The msm thinks they’re comparable

 

[Dattier]

Another day, another class deprived of education because their teacher thinks he's owning the nazis on a college basketball message board.

What's my job title again?

 

[Dattier]

View embedded media

Wrong again.

 

[Dattier]

All the Dems get leniency like Robert Byrd. Republicans not so much.

Sen Byrd famously renounced his brief membership in the KKK for years.

While data on Republican and Democratic historians is available, I focused on conservative and liberal, which aren't inherently the same.

President Jackson is certainly a darling of conservatives, whatever his political party was. Washington and Jefferson were both top 5 for liberal historians despite having owned slaves.

It seems like you're just looking for a fight. All I did was present facts and reasonable analysis.

 

[Dattier]

Universities are echo chambers now and conservative students often complain about pressure to conform to their professor’s viewpoint. Like with free speech, critical thinking skills are championed until these skills lead to an unpopular conclusion. Then the harassment and name calling starts. Not unlike this message board

Critical thinking skills expose conservative students to viewpoints beyond their own. Conservative students are more likely to come from less diverse areas, rural areas, religious backgrounds, and to have narrower experiences. All of that breeds rigidity. Being exposed to new information is the goal of every single class in the history of classes. For rigid people, that feels threatening. They prefer their conservative bubble.

So broadly, those complaints are largely snowflakes whining that they've been presented with info that challenges their biases. I won't rule out the existence of such professors, of course, though I think they're rarer than you think. I doubt you're willing to concede as much because you're one of the rigid.

At last count, there are two liberals who post here regularly. If you think we're the primary perpetrators of harassment and name-calling, you're dumber than I knew.

 

[GhostOf301]

What's my job title again?

I'm not sure what the professional title would be. The fluffer?

 

[Mac9192]

Liberalism is a lot like cotton candy. It seems appealing, until you see it for yourself. Once a person gets into the real world, what they thought of as being true and righteous, is again, a lot like cotton candy. In most cases, what they thought was wrong, really is correct.

 

[KDSTONE]

Critical thinking skills expose conservative students to viewpoints beyond their own. Conservative students are more likely to come from less diverse areas, rural areas, religious backgrounds, and to have narrower experiences. All of that breeds rigidity. Being exposed to new information is the goal of every single class in the history of classes. For rigid people, that feels threatening. They prefer their conservative bubble.

So broadly, those complaints are largely snowflakes whining that they've been presented with info that challenges their biases. I won't rule out the existence of such professors, of course, though I think they're rarer than you think. I doubt you're willing to concede as much because you're one of the rigid.

At last count, there are two liberals who post here regularly. If you think we're the primary perpetrators of harassment and name-calling, you're dumber than I knew.

Chock full of stereotypes and name calling. Your stock in trade.

 

[KDSTONE]

Critical thinking skills expose conservative students to viewpoints beyond their own. Conservative students are more likely to come from less diverse areas, rural areas, religious backgrounds, and to have narrower experiences. All of that breeds rigidity. Being exposed to new information is the goal of every single class in the history of classes. For rigid people, that feels threatening. They prefer their conservative bubble.

So broadly, those complaints are largely snowflakes whining that they've been presented with info that challenges their biases. I won't rule out the existence of such professors, of course, though I think they're rarer than you think. I doubt you're willing to concede as much because you're one of the rigid.

At last count, there are two liberals who post here regularly. If you think we're the primary perpetrators of harassment and name-calling, you're dumber than I knew.

Yet it’s liberal students who freak out every time a conservative is scheduled to speak on their campus. Frequent cancel culture in action. You and the other one only tolerate our presence because you’re outnumbered on this board. If ever you Leftists gained the majority here, as well as the mod spots, we’d be banned every other week.

 

[KDSTONE]

Critical thinking skills expose conservative students to viewpoints beyond their own. Conservative students are more likely to come from less diverse areas, rural areas, religious backgrounds, and to have narrower experiences. All of that breeds rigidity. Being exposed to new information is the goal of every single class in the history of classes. For rigid people, that feels threatening. They prefer their conservative bubble.

So broadly, those complaints are largely snowflakes whining that they've been presented with info that challenges their biases. I won't rule out the existence of such professors, of course, though I think they're rarer than you think. I doubt you're willing to concede as much because you're one of the rigid.

At last count, there are two liberals who post here regularly. If you think we're the primary perpetrators of harassment and name-calling, you're dumber than I knew.

How about the professors keep their political opinions to themselves? It has no relevance in an engineering or accounting class. As far as the humanities and liberal arts go, it seems more in place, but you still run up against the whole captive audience thing. Unethical to use their taxpayer funded position to influence someone else’s political beliefs. Somewhat different at a private school

 

[Dattier]

I'm not sure what the professional title would be. The fluffer?

i kinda walked into that one. Well-played.

 

[Dattier]

Chock full of stereotypes and name calling. Your stock in trade.

No, moron, name-calling would be like what I just did in the second word of this sentence. When there's a thorough explanation with it, it's appropriate labeling.

Stereotypes all have a prototype. There's a fine line between talking about trends and stereotyping. I tried to be careful, using words like "more often" and "broadly." It appears I was right on the money predicting you would not concede that there's any gray area.

Further, don't be a hypocrite about name-calling and stereotyping. You do both all the time, as do most of us. I acknowledge my role in that.

 

[Dattier]

Yet it’s liberal students who freak out every time a conservative is scheduled to speak on their campus.

Agreed. Liberal students freak out over conservative guest speakers. Full stop.

And conservative students freak out over liberal professors.

Those may not be equivalent things, but the freaking out is: both are emotionally compromised and exaggerated. Again, I doubt you'll concede anything here because you're rigid.

 

[Dattier]

You and the other one only tolerate our presence because you’re outnumbered on this board. If ever you Leftists gained the majority here, as well as the mod spots, we’d be banned every other week.

lol
You really don't know me. I could tell you stories about how I'm the voice of reason speaking up against adding language about social and racial justice to the preamble of a certain group's constitution, or advising the room against ousting amiable school board members who break from our opinion on very few, select issues. Well, I guess I just gave you a summary; I doubt you'll believe me anyway.

But also, that's just a stupid, unfounded claim. There's no actual way to prove it either way unless liberals DO become the norm here, and there's no risk of that. So you're making up something negative without evidence. That's illogical, stupid, bad faith, and really immature. You're so rigid and intellectually insecure you project your fears onto us.

 

[Mac9192]

Did any of you see Kamala’s interview with Bret Baier on Fox? The girl is so far in over her head.

She has a major problem. People want to see her do interviews, but if she does, it’s obvious why she doesn’t.

 

[GhostOf301]

There used to be a good representation from the left and the right, here. Most of the lefties grabbed their ball and went home when they didn't get their preferred outcome in 2016. Then some made a brief return after the potato won. It only became a right wing echo chamber after the left wingers ran away.

 

[Dattier]

How about the professors keep their political opinions to themselves? It has no relevance in an engineering or accounting class. As far as the humanities and liberal arts go, it seems more in place, but you still run up against the whole captive audience thing. Unethical to use their taxpayer funded position to influence someone else’s political beliefs. Somewhat different at a private school

I don't see the relevance in engineering or accounting, either. I know from teaching middle school, high school, and college that students often bring these things up themselves whether it's related to the class content or not. Those are teachable moments and contribute to building rapport and classroom culture.

There are certain things that are absolutely vital to schools' missions of educating all their students that qualify as beliefs, and unapologetically so. For example, courts have consistently ruled that while students have free speech on campus (Tinker v Des Moines, for one), there are permissible restrictions on free speech that disrupts the school's educational purpose (Bethel v Frasier, for one). A kid denouncing homosexuality in a public school classroom, for example, may be seen as threatening to a gay student, and school employees would be within their rights to quash it. That's not "pushing a gay agenda." That's maintaining a safe environment for all students. That could happen even in an engineering or accounting class.

Courts have also ruled that students deserve public school educations regardless of immigration status (Plyer v Doe). Obviously that gets into a hot button political issue. If it comes to it, it would be appropriate for school employees to quash certain conservative rhetoric about immigration as threatening toward immigrant classmates. (Again, certain rhetoric.)

There is a difference between stating one's beliefs and pushing those beliefs just like there's a difference between teaching how to think (critical thinking skills) and what to think (specific beliefs).

(Speaking of taxpayer funded positions, as long as public schools are funded by tax dollars, as they should be, there will always be an inherently political element to them.)