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Okafor Theory

bdotling

All Conference
Sep 28, 2009
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Edited per dukiejay's request.

But the stats shown in this study of ACC play show that we as a team play better without Okafor on the floor, primarily due to his defensive liabilities and even offensively we average more points per possession because of how stagnant we can become when we just feed him in the post.

It's not a perfect analysis and it's not arguing we would be better off without him, but I do think K needs to find better ways to use him to mask his defensive liabilities and not run as much offense through him. 3-5 min less a game would be a good start just so he has more legs to get back on D.

https://okafortheory.wordpress.com

This post was edited on 2/27 2:39 PM by bdotling

https://okafortheory.wordpress.com
 
This is the exact same thing our team did with Rivers and Parker as well.
 
I agree. I feel it has something to do with K needing to showcase one and dones to help with his recruiting on that front. There needs to be a better balance because it is hurting our maximum potential
 
I don't know if I agree that it's K feeling he needs to showcase one and done talent. I don't really know what the answer is, however. If you have the most offensively dominate big man in the country, he needs to touch the ball. I think K probably looks at it that way. However, it runs the risk of becoming over reliant on one player. I think it's just a hard thing balance and people will feel he's getting too few touches if K cuts back and too many if he continues as we've seen.
 
Good lord, look, I wish Plumlee could play more minutes for Jah to get some rest, but that is where I draw the line. We are not a better team without him on the floor. If anything it opens things up more for our shooters with him on the floor because of the double team. Anyway, it was a well written article. Thanks for sharing!
 
Maybe so on the offensive end, but it shouldn't keep K holding guys like Jah or Jabari liable for how bad they are on defense. It is surprising he lets that go
 
Bllediteveryday - the numbers show offensively we are more productive without him on the floor though, even if he is providing additional spacing, Tyus and Quinn have been so elite that it doesn't matter if he is on the floor or not. One could argue he takes away from their touches as they are more offensively efficient players. But anyway it's not arguing he shouldn't be on the floor, it is saying we can use him better
 
Lol. The dangers of statistics. Couple points. That may be a valid argument when you're talking about how Duke plays against mediocre teams (like BC), but the argument falls flat on its face when you look at the road games at Louisville / UVA -- which is the reason why this team is viewed far more highly than last year's Duke team, for example. Relatedly, the overwhelming majority of the non-Okafor possessions described in that analysis came against the weaker opponents / games that were blowouts -- which makes sense, as Okafor sits more against weaker squads. 1/4 of the possessions, in fact, are from the Clemson game alone.

Also, when Okafor's typically in the game, he's going against the opposition's starters. Marshall comes in against the backups. Relatedly, it ignores who else comes in at the time same time. Early in the conference season, it was Sheed / Matt Jones -- and, now, it's also Matt Jones -- i.e., our best perimeter on-ball defender. I don't think anyone would be surprised to see a Sheed / Jones / Plumlee defense perform better than a Cook / Tyus Jones / Okafor defense, and frankly -- is it a surprise that our bench of former McAA would be outplaying the bench of whoever we're going against.

Personally, I think Marshall should play more -- but, on the other hand, I think K's hoping that the excessive minutes now will get him used to playing heavy minutes in the tourney. If the goal was to maximize per possession efficiency in regular season games we're winning anyways, then maybe this would have a point. But, that's not the point of this season.

This post was edited on 2/27 12:03 PM by aah555
 
Clemson per Kenpom is better than their record. The fact we dominated without him is relevant and shouldn't be dismissed. When Okafor is in against weaker squads, we should dominate even more than when he's not in, so not really understanding your argument there... Regardless he plays so many minutes as is the whole sub/backup thing gets washed out, especially since we tend to play to our level of competition

I think Okafor is capable of playing defense, I tend to think he does pick it up a bit more for bigger more marquee games. But it's kinda unfortunate he has to shoot over 65% from the field to make up for his poor defense against a team like VA Tech. He's the most gifted offensive center I've seen ever in college hoops personally, but that doesn't mean he's used in a way that maximizes our teams potential. Which again is what the stats back up
 
Originally posted by aah555:
Lol. The dangers of statistics. Couple points. That may be a valid argument when you're talking about how Duke plays against mediocre teams (like BC), but the argument falls flat on its face when you look at the road games at Louisville / UVA -- which is the reason why this team is viewed far more highly than last year's Duke team, for example. Relatedly, the overwhelming majority of the non-Okafor possessions described in that analysis came against the weaker opponents / games that were blowouts -- which makes sense, as Okafor sits more against weaker squads. 1/4 of the possessions, in fact, are from the Clemson game alone.

Also, when Okafor's typically in the game, he's going against the opposition's starters. Marshall comes in against the backups. Relatedly, it ignores who else comes in at the time same time. Early in the conference season, it was Sheed / Matt Jones -- and, now, it's also Matt Jones -- i.e., our best perimeter on-ball defender. I don't think anyone would be surprised to see a Sheed / Jones / Plumlee defense perform better than a Cook / Tyus Jones / Okafor defense, and frankly -- is it a surprise that our bench of former McAA would be outplaying the bench of whoever we're going against.

Personally, I think Marshall should play more -- but, on the other hand, I think K's hoping that the excessive minutes now will get him used to playing heavy minutes in the tourney. If the goal was to maximize per possession efficiency in regular season games we're winning anyways, then maybe this would have a point. But, that's not the point of this season.

This post was edited on 2/27 12:03 PM by aah555
Great job aah. I think it is crazy for anyone to say that we are statistically better without Jah. Now, free throws are another story, but nobody on this team shoots well from the ft line except for Tyus and Quinn.
 
I don't follow your argument, against weaker squads we should dominate even more when he is in then when he isn't. Also since we tend to play to the level of our comp, he plays heavy minutes against the backups and subs as well. Clemson is better than their record on Kenpom and the fact we played so well without him shouldn't be dismissed.

As per the bigger matchups, I think Jah is capable of playing better on D, and he tends to get up for the bigger names. That generally bodes well for us. But it also shouldn't be the case he needs to hit 65% from the field to make up for his defensive lapses against a team like VA Tech for us to win. VA Tech by all measures is awful this year. Anyway the point is that he needs to be used better not that we shouldn't play him...
 
stats are just numbers. There's nothing crazy about them, just numbers. That's a good point on free throws, if he hit them maybe all of this would be moot because he'd be so offensively efficient it wouldn't matter how bad his defense is. But the fact is he doesn't, so he has trouble offsetting his poor defensive performance
 
laugh.r191677.gif
At least they called it a theory!

Short stretches we can do without Jah, but if this team loses his 66% shooting, 9+ rebounds, and ability to draw not only double but triple teams...you'll see how quickly those 3 point percentages will go down, and the ability to drive knowing you can dish to Oak for the jam, or see him get an offensive rebound...which he is the king of. I've got a theory too, something happens to Jah, and we'll just call mine the 'bleary dreary where the hell is Duke theory'.

Oh, and great post, Aah

OFC
 
Has anyone considered that Jah's seemingly lack of D aggressiveness maybe lends itself more to him being a Freshman than it does to him as a player? It's pretty well known that most Freshmen have to learn to play D b/c they really didn't have to in HS. With Jah presumably being the #1 pick in next years draft. It's probably even harded for K to hold him truly accountable for his lack of D at times. There a reason why UVa is laced with veteran players and that they play GREAT D. They kinda go hand in hand. Look it drives me nuts at times when I see opposing team players attacking the basket and Jah either doesn't step up to defend or doesn't help from the weak side when he could. At the same time, I don't care about any stat or stats that would suggest Duke is a better O or D team without him on the floor. That's just a silly argument that should never even be brought up.
 
Okafor provides this team with much needed balance on offense...You can talk about defense until you are blue in the face but offensively it is not even up for debate Okafor is our most important offense player....Take him out of the equation and you would see no offensive production from either Matt Jones or Grayson Allen and you would see shooting percentages of Cook and Tyus Jones drop significantly....If you look at things through a small window you will be blinded to the big picture....The quality of shots Duke would get without Okafor would be much lower...Through a small window tougher shots won't always result less makes, but over the course of the season the law of averages will eventually catch up....Come tournament time I want a balanced offense and that is what Okafor provides.
 
Originally posted by bdotling:
I don't follow your argument, against weaker squads we should dominate even more when he is in then when he isn't. Also since we tend to play to the level of our comp, he plays heavy minutes against the backups and subs as well. Clemson is better than their record on Kenpom and the fact we played so well without him shouldn't be dismissed.

As per the bigger matchups, I think Jah is capable of playing better on D, and he tends to get up for the bigger names. That generally bodes well for us. But it also shouldn't be the case he needs to hit 65% from the field to make up for his defensive lapses against a team like VA Tech for us to win. VA Tech by all measures is awful this year. Anyway the point is that he needs to be used better not that we shouldn't play him...
Not necessarily. Against weaker squads, it's not surprising that we'd be more efficient with a smaller / quicker lineup that pressures the ball, gets in transition, jacks-up 3s, and is still big enough to get offensive boards. The problem, though, is that approach doesn't work that well when you run into good teams who can stay with our guards, take care of the ball, have bigs of their own who can dominate the paint against Marshall etc.

Also, has it ever crossed your mind that K tries to time Okafor's rest period with moments when our backups can succeed? Marshall can be good at times, but his effectiveness is definitely partly contingent on how he's being used. Relatedly, I'd further add that the stats are further skewed b/c K will leave the non-Okafor group out there longer if they're playing well, but will quickly put Okafor back in when he sees they're struggling. If you look at the Louisville game, for example, Duke got outscored 13-5 in 10 possessions when Okafor was out. When that's happening, Okafor goes back in; rather than let the backups let the lead slip away. By contrast, when they're playing well, they stay out there longer (like against FSU) -- which distorts the numbers. The inverse is not true. When our team is getting badly outplayed by State / Miami, Okafor is left out there -- even though nobody watching either of those games would place the blame for our performances in either game on Okafor.

This post was edited on 2/27 12:46 PM by aah555
 
Chov - everything you wrote is moot as this study looks at how the team does without him on the floor. Did you read it before commenting? Hint our players score more efficiently when he's not out there

Also 750 possessions worth of data isn't a small window
 
That's a good point aah. The problem is we aren't exactly cruising against most teams in ACC play where K decides to leave him off the floor. His substitution patterns have been very distinct and he hasn't let him rest in the second half. There was no reason he should have played the entire second half against UNC. I think NC State was kinda of fluky with how well they shot but Miami had a lot to do with him. They were running a ton of high pick and rolls on us and he had no idea how to guard and help with that. It's startig to become a trend of hot shooting against us because he's the first point of rotation and isn't very good at it so other guys have to bail him out leaving open shooters

I'm glad you at least read the article. Not sure some other folks commenting here bothered to
 
Yeah aah going to have to really disagree with you on Miami the more I think about it. They ran the same high PnRs all day on us
 
When we shoot too many 3's we complain that we don't have a true center and when we land arguably the best college center in the last decade we complain because he's getting too many touches. Unbelievable
 
Ryan - I think you are missing the point. K did the same with Austin and Jabari. It's nothing to do with position, it has a lot to do with how he is showing a pattern of over utilizing his top talent. What was great about 2010 and seth/Ryan/Mason is that we were balanced in our attack. You are making blanket statements without reading what is being posted
 
Now I understand this article a little better. I just found a part of the original draft of this paper.

Okafor%20Theory%20Rope%20a%20Dope.jpg


OFC
This post was edited on 2/27 1:36 PM by OldasdirtDevil
 
You don't come here and take shots at the owner of the site. That's just not a good thing to do.

We can have the discussion about Okafor, but you better edit your original post or this thread gets deleted within an hour. Use common sense.
 
Wow, Okafor is killing us, let's cut his ass! (Insert a 75 ft tall roll eyes icon here)
 
TO be honest, the only real examples we have of playing without Oakafor are the first half on the ND game at home. He got 2 early fouls. But before he went out, we were already starting to pull away. That was our day regardless. We just played great. And then the one game he didn't play. And we played great but it was a group of guys playing at home and knowing they had to step up since Oak wasn't playing.

I have a theory of my own with his defense. I have wondered if K has asked him not to be aggressive so he doesn't pick up fouls, knowing how important it is that he stays in the game and especially now that we are only 8 players deep. I doubt that is the case, but I have wondered. Duke is so good offensively, I guess K knows that we can probably score on anyone and if we give up a few baskets, we can overcome it. I actually think that we need Amile to be the "goon" if you will on defense. Be reckless. Use your fouls. Be the guy that scares others form going to the rim.
 
Originally posted by Showenuff:
Wow, Okafor is killing us, let's cut his ass! (Insert a 75 ft tall roll eyes icon here)
why can't folks read the article before making these comments.

This is a direct quote from it:
"Is Marshall Plumlee Better at Basketball than Jahlil Okafor?

No. Nobody is saying that. Nobody who has ever seen these two players play basketball would ever say that.

What these numbers imply is that Okafor's team would likely be better off this season if Okafor plays more of a Plumlee role in the offense and saves some energy to put in Plumlee-level effort on defense. Plumlee getting more playing time isn't a necessary part of this equation, but Plumlee playing a little bit more would likely help Okafor on defense by giving Okafor more rest and allowing Okafor to defend more aggressively without such fear of fouling (Okafor's fouls committed per 40 minutes of 2.9 is currently the 3rd lowest on Duke, only higher than Duke's starting guards)."

Instead people read a couple snippets and furiously type away. I'm trying to have a reasoned discussion and only a couple of folks have responded as such, such as mpm and aah. And I don't even agree with aah, but at least we can have a civil back and forth about it. I'm not saying to not play with him, I'm saying to change the way we play with him. Snowenuff, your comments aren't helpful here.



This post was edited on 2/27 2:46 PM by bdotling
 
Originally posted by dukiejay:
You don't come here and take shots at the owner of the site. That's just not a good thing to do.

We can have the discussion about Okafor, but you better edit your original post or this thread gets deleted within an hour. Use common sense.
I edited per your request, though I don't think it was inflammatory. I just said I wasn't able to have a conversation with him about it. Apologies if you and Brian if you all took it as a shot.
 
Not that Oak is the on this level.... but I remember games when it seemed like Shelden Williams would play passively for long stretches, then in the last 4 minutes or so he would step and start going after blocks and rebounds much more aggressively... and he had to e somewhat passive because of his importance to those Duke teams. I have seen Oaks level of intensity pick up on the boards and D later in close games. AAU and high school certainly did not prep him to play D...and that is some of the problem... but maybe its a planned thing as well.
 
Yes it's true Jah is a terrible free throw shooter. I said that too many times. Sometimes he looks bad on defense all though that may be due to some one else missing an assignment. I read that he's soft or he's lazy then I read he's a bully. You know what I think. I think no matter what we tend to find fault with our players. I think we've become way to spoiled. I think we've starting to over analyze things I think Jah is a beast and we would be sucking rotten eggs without him. He's a killer my fellow Duke fans and I know that every team in the country would love to have him standing down in the paint. OFC
 
I think this was a good 'article' and post. There are some obvious flaws but this site needs more conversations like these. My initial thought was the data needs to be scrubbed for 'junk time'. Football analytics does this when looking at yards per play and points per possession. The caveat to that is K historically leaves starters in for much of the game even in blowouts. Something that drives me crazy. Oakafor averages 31 mpg so he isn't sitting much. He is the best offensive center I have ever seen but that does not meen the numbers and argument are flawed. You have to look at the net net of his offense and defense. If he score 30 but his guy score 25 his impact is lessened. In addition I'm not sold on the fact that MP3's rebounding numbers wouldn't look similar with 31 mpg. Jah is an average rebounder.

K has had a double standard defensively with guys like Rivers/Parker/Jah. He has banished guys like Dawkins to the end of the pine for poor defense. I have always found our bigs lack of ability to defend the pick and roll puzzling considering the NBA's reliance on it and K's time with the Olympic team. MP2 was bad and Jah has been worse.

Currently the interior defense and FT shooting is the biggest concern for a title run. Considering what Carolina did to us on the boards I shutter to think what Kentucky would do.
 
Thanks LastWaltz for taking the time to thoughtfully engage. I messaged the author to ask about junk time, he didn't do anything around that, but he did look at times when the other team is intentionally fouling and he's off the court b/c of Free Throw shooting, the offensive efficiency numbers without him get discounted slightly, but still stand around 1.28 points per possession.

I think this whole article doesn't hold water if Okafor hits his free throws at a 70% clip. Dude is talented, that would just be unfair at that point. Unfortunately he doesn't.

However, I do think he's capable of playing better on d. I think he can put himself out there more, right now it feels like he's afraid to get in foul trouble, but maybe too afraid where it hurts us on defense? Perhaps it got compounded with Semi and Sheed leaving the team leaving the bench shorter.

I think he does get more involved for big games as mentioned a couple posts above. It bodes well for us if we get beyond the sweet 16, I do worry a bit about the games before hand. Much of these stats may be one of the reasons we tend to play to the level of our competition (including UNC, as exciting as that game was, we really should have whipped them).
 
I'd rather have Jah than not, but when he is on the court, the defense clogs the lane which makes it really hard for our guards or Winslow to drive.
 
Originally posted by LastWaltz:

K has had a double standard defensively with guys like Rivers/Parker/Jah. He has banished guys like Dawkins to the end of the pine for poor defense. I have always found our bigs lack of ability to defend the pick and roll puzzling considering the NBA's reliance on it and K's time with the Olympic team. MP2 was bad and Jah has been worse.
I don't really get why we're clumping all these guys together. For starters, Austin Rivers' defense wasn't bad at all. It wasn't great, but he was clearly the best on the ball defender we had that year -- with maybe the exception of Tyler Thornton. He was clearly a better defender than the guys who did get significant minutes (Seth Curry, Dawkins, and Q. Cook as a freshman).

As for Parker / Jah, they entered situations where we needed each to serve as the anchor's of our offense. That can't happen from the bench. With regard to Dawkins, it's not a double standard. It's a reflection of reality. Dawkins' offense wasn't good enough to overlook how much he hurt us defensively. That's not the case with Parker / Jah.

Moreover, the question is what do you get from benching Parker / Jah? I have no idea. If they struggled on the defensive end b/c they were ignoring the coach's direction or simply not putting in the effort, then maybe benching them would be a useful tool. But, if they're trying their best to improve and the problem is that neither anticipates well, haven't spent nearly enough time before this year working on defensive footwork, need to work on general lateral agility, and need to improve their conditioning --- then you achieve nothing from benching them other than basically wasting their offensive talent and alienating future recruits. As we saw dramatically with Sheed, K's not going to tolerate guys who aren't doing everything they can to help the team win. While I'm sure K's not happy with Okafor's defense, my guess is he understands that Okafor's doing whatever he reasonably can to improve -- and that some of the issues are just problems that can't be fixed in a single season.

With regard to the pick-and-roll, it is a bit puzzling -- but, I do feel as if the Olympic experience hasn't helped him nearly as much on that side of the ball b/c the team he fields is so much more athletic than its opposition that it can still execute the intense, ball-pressure defense he prefers -- and the C's he's had to anchor those teams have been extremely athletic (Bosh, Howard, Tyson Chandler, and even some Lamar Odom -- who internationally was big enough to play that position).

Unless you've got UK's roster (and can physically overwhelm the opposition), I just don't think Coach K's traditional approach to man-to-man D really works anymore because players have become so much more adept at one-on-one play. 15-20 years ago, most teams still run motion / sets, and didn't have a ton of guards who could regularly take their men one-on-one. In that world, pressuring your man and disrupting the flow of the offense would be enough to be successful. I just don't think that's the case anymore. Even the average, mediocre freshman guard on a team like Va Tech has the talent to go one-on-one if you extend too far. I am glad we started experimenting with zones, but it is odd to me that K didn't completely overhaul his approach to D after how our Ds have looked playing the pressure man-to-man style over the past 6-7 years.
 
Originally posted by stanleyduke:
I'd rather have Jah than not, but when he is on the court, the defense clogs the lane which makes it really hard for our guards or Winslow to drive.
Me too! That's not really the point, maybe the tagline of the article is offputting so people don't read the rest of it. We need Okafor, absolutely he's a stud, but to your second part of the sentence, we can find ways to utilize him more efficiently for the team to perform to it's maximum potential.
 
Originally posted by bdotling:

Originally posted by stanleyduke:
I'd rather have Jah than not, but when he is on the court, the defense clogs the lane which makes it really hard for our guards or Winslow to drive.
Me too! That's not really the point, maybe the tagline of the article is offputting so people don't read the rest of it. We need Okafor, absolutely he's a stud, but to your second part of the sentence, we can find ways to utilize him more efficiently for the team to perform to it's maximum potential.
It's fine as a discussion point, but your argument rests on a lot of flawed premises. For instance, a key assumption to this "better utility" argument is that somehow Okafor would be a better defender if he focused more on defense than offense. Now, maybe that's true on the margins, but I've watched him enough to know that most of his problems defensively relate to lack of awareness, lack of lateral agility, and typical conditioning issues for a freshman 6'11 270 pounder. While Okafor's offensive game is more akin to that of a sr., reality is that he's played defense like most freshman bigs would play defense if you asked them to play 30+ minutes. In fact, if you look around the country, of the bigs ranked around Okafor (Myles Turner, Cliff Alexander, Karl Anthony Towns) --- only he is being asked to play 30+ minutes. And that's even though Turner / Towns clearly have more talent on the defensive end. IMO, the only way to get better play from him on the defensive end is to radically reduce his minutes (like make him a 15 or 20 min. guy), tell him to not worry about fouls, and, even then, I don't think he would be great. I think people are dabbling in a bit of fantasy if they think Okafor's D would be great if we simply spent less time posting him up.

As for the offense, nobody denies that putting 4 shooters on the court and jacking up 3s can be a more efficient way to score if you're getting looks and hot from the perimeter -- as 3s are worth more than 2s. The problem is what happens when you're not hitting 3s, or when you need a higher percentage score? Historically, Duke's problem in the last decade of NCAA tourneys has been that its prolific, high-volume 3 pt. shooting teams have aggregated great offensive statistics all year --- and then go cold for a stretch of an NCAA tourney game and get knocked out. The real value of Okafor is on the nights where the shots are not falling and need easy baskets. See the close of the Va Tech game, for instance, where Okafor repeatedly pretty much scored or got to the line every time he got the ball.

If you go back to the Mercer game, by contrast, Duke actually held a 63-58 lead with a little less than 5 minutes to go. Then what happened? Two turnovers on forced drives into the lane and 3 straight missed 3s. By when we scored again 4 minutes later, we had already fallen behind 69-63 and the game was basically over. If you look at last year's team, statistically, it was arguably better this year's squad. In reality, however, it's not that close -- b/c this year's team is not prone to the type of long scoring droughts / volatility that plagued last year's team. The biggest difference is okafor.

To prove my point, just look at individual contests. Last year, Duke was held below 70 in 10 of 21 ACC contests -- and lost 3 of those games. This year's team? Duke has only been held below 70 in 2 of 15 ACC contests and won both of those below 70 pt. games (@Louisville, @UVA) --- i.e., we haven't lost any games b/c of our offense. In other words, while Duke's aggregate statistics last year were about the same as this year's team, the functional reality is that having a guy like Okafor in there is critical to bringing consistency in the offense.

This post was edited on 2/27 3:35 PM by aah555
 
I agree wholeheartedly with your second paragraph. Because of the lose and you're out format, having a reliable low post scorer can help if for one game you are off. I don't think the Mercer game is a great example because last year's teams faced similar problems like that all of last year. Our team for most every game would be up 10 points at any given time and collapse because our defense was so bad that it'd put a crippling amount of pressure on our offense to keep it up and we just couldn't. But generally I see what you are saying.

The thing with our offense though is that it can be more efficient then it is if we don't run a strong majority of our plays through him and mix it up a little bit more. That's where we aren't doing as good a job as we can. There are 750 possessions where Okafor plays where our efficiency makes us look like an average offensive team. If we did things like again Va Tech where he caught the ball in the high post and fed it down to Justise, varied it up a bit more, I think we'd have more success with him in the game.

Defensively, I'm not sure where the conclusion you got that we need to radically reduce his minutes for him to improve. And Okafor is one of the most agile bigs I"ve seen, so I don't really buy that portion either. I do agree with lack of awareness. I think conditioning is an issue, so play him 3-5 minutes less a game. I think that'd help on the margin. Also he needs to either hedge or stay in the lane on the screens, he's consistently caught in no man's land. Again, the Miami game, a lot of that was due to them taking advantage of where our defense weaknesses are most visible. Also, his block rate is one of the lowest of any elite big man in recent years. There is no reason for his foul rate to be so low, he can take more chances on that end if he just learned to commit. Maybe one hypothesis is that K has told him not to get in foul trouble given how thin we are, but Jah seems to have taken that to an extreme.

I never said he'd be better on D if we spent less time posting him up...that is fantasy, but you are coming up with arguments to points I never made.

I think the way he is used can be improved on defense, he can afford to be more aggressive...maybe that's where we just agree to disagree.

This post was edited on 2/27 5:39 PM by bdotling
 
i will say though, on the night that shots aren't falling and we need Okafor, I do worry about the opposing team fouling him. That's probably the best way to neutralize us if we have an offnight.
 
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