Not much going on with the football board right now. Once minicamp and fall camp reports get started I’ll be in there head first. Basketball season is technically still going on. Just because I’m football first I know basketball as well. Some of you just get upset when someone disagrees with you or God forbid Coach K. Y’all protect him more than yourself
Cam R
- Thread starter GabeM1234
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Not much going on with the football board right now. Once minicamp and fall camp reports get started I’ll be in there head first. Basketball season is technically still going on. Just because I’m football first I know basketball as well. Some of you just get upset when someone disagrees with you or God forbid Coach K. Y’all protect him more than yourself
I disagree with K sometimes. If you don’t know that you aren’t paying attention but how he used cam is deff not one of those times. Dude couldn’t dribble past a paper bag
Cam is training at Accelerate Basketball in Charlotte for NBA draft prep. My BIL ran into him and said CAM could not be nicer as talked with youngsters and took pics. Accelerate is where Step Curry trains, they teach media and PR as well. Accelerate rep said they are prepping Cam for the "why did you defer to 3rd option" questions from teams.
If you say so. Cam has shown since he became a teenager that he can handle the basketball and be a lead guard if need be. He bought into a role and it affected the rest of his game to an extent. If we ever took RJ off the floor and let Cam be the guy you would’ve saw a difference. It happened in a few games where Cam just took over as option number 1
He may have taken a role and it may have taken him off the ball to a certain extent, but most of it was the game being too fast for Cam. I think he grew some, which could have had something to do with it, but he was going to drive and leaving the ball where he started from....a lot. To me that means his body just couldn't catch up to what his mind wanted to do. The game may slow down for him some in the league and he may catch up with his body, but K had nothing to do with that. He was a walking turnover when trying to create most of the time. I like Cam and personally think he should embrace the 3 and D tag. That's today's NBA.
Man, I totally agree with everything you have said. If anybody watched Cam Reddish his last 2 years in high school, and on the team USA, he was a better player with the ball in his hands. I'm not sure what his role at Duke was, and he was clearly a different player with his spot up role. Yes, he did lose the ball a lot on drives or got called for charges often. My opinion, he was trying too hard when the opportunity did come for him to initiate off the dribble. Cam went from being the primary ball handler to most of the time the fourth option to handle it at Duke.
I haven't been on much since the season ended and won't, but fans can start watching games of future Duke recruits/prospect. A lot of these top guys games are streamed online. Helps to see a guys game before he gets to school. I think Cam would have been a different player on another team. Dude is a baller and just watching all the attention the other 3 studs got all year, I'm sure it affected him at times. How soon we forget he was ranked the number 1 recruit at times over RJ and Zion. People will see a different Cam Reddish with the right fit.
Coach K takes a lot of heat here....I'm not sure what you've been reading.
Listen, we can sit here all day and say he was misused and go back and forth. Truth of the matter is....Cam struggled for large chunks of the season. What was the cause? None of us truly know. We can speculate all we want. I think sometimes he forced and sometimes he deferred too much. There were instances where he looked very much like a top-five recruit, and other times not so much. Part of being great is handling the mental aspect. At times, I think that's something that alluded Cam. It's not his fault, it's not the coaches faults....it's part of the basic maturation process that each player goes through. Not only was Cam forced to go through it on the biggest stage at Duke, he had to do it in the shadow of maybe the best individual college player we've seen this generation. There's more than one factor at play here.
Bringing in Alpha players from HS teams and trying to blend them isnt easy - someone has to sacrifice for it to work. I think Cam did sacrifice some of his game but he also didnt maximize his opportunity when it was presented. Zion was hurt, he could have stepped into that void, Tre was hurt , that could have been a chance. Its a shame we probably didnt get to see all Cam had to offer or him at his best...the blame for that can be spread around to a lot of places, no single source
I really think you are the man for the BB job but I understand you wanting to coach football. Did you interview for the Duke OC when Scottie Montgomery left for ECU? Wold consider Cut's job if there should be a change in head football coaches at Duke. I don't know about the rest of DI but I have a feeling you are already an accomplished coach and maybe we'll known. Am I on to something here. Also don't pay any attention to your doubters on this board. They are jealous of your knowledge. You could probably do a great job with the LX team, golf team, soccer, swimming , baseball and anything else you decided to tackle. A regular Knute Rockne is what you are. OFC
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Jack of all trades. I try man. Appreciate the nice words. Lacrosse is not something I can get into. Golf and baseball is not exciting enough to keep my attention. Soccer is ok. I never played it. I actually was a lifeguard in high school for a summer so swimming is an option.
If Coach K would’ve created an equal opportunity offense then I think Cam would been more comfortable. I’m sure Cam loves RJ but I’m also sure he would sit there on the wing and say “well I know I’m not about to get the ball”. Then we he got it he either rushed a shot or just drove into the defense. He has been wired a certain way his whole life. You have players that were superstars in college but get to the nba and become bench players. You sit back and say “I remember when such and such was in college and he could get any shot he wanted” but in the nba he doesn’t even look like a competent ball handler. It happens like that all the time. Cam had been drilled to be a 3 and D guy. He took pride in that. You can see by how hard he played on defense. He definitely didn’t get to show his talents at Duke. I don’t know how anyone can argue that.
Do you think Coach K used Tre right? I think Coach K hindered Tre as well. He showcased Tre weakness. No way RJ usage should’ve been that high on a team with this much talent.
You are the best. Maybe if Coach K and Coach Cut knew who you are and read some of your expertise we would have been in some big bowl games, won a conference championship or two and have about 7 or 8 natty's in basketball. If I had to knowledge you have I would respectfully make suggestions to both of them.
My opinion is Cam got lots of chances to prove himself, it's not like he was on the proverbial quick hook, he just couldn't perform on a regular basis. However I have no doubt that he will succeed in time and I will root for him because he seemed like a good guy who played hard on defense even when he was struggling on offense.
Absolutely shocked that this is what your comeback was to a poster criticizing K
Cam’s got all the tools but I don’t think he has the dog in him to be an all-star level player - especially if he finds himself in a place with off the court attractions.
He was the 3rd option on our offense, that’s correct. However, Cam and a lot of you posting replies on here are misinterpreting that with having a small role and letting it be the excuse for his weak performances.
He averaged 12 FGA per game this year. That’s 1 less attempt than Zion. Within that he averaged 7-8 3PTA per game, to put that in perspective JJ Redick averaged 9 3PTA his senior year. So not getting enough touches and all that crap is not an excuse. His usage and attempts prove that he was a highly included part of the offense. His makes and horrific percentages prove that he didn’t showcase himself properly most nights. That’s not Coach K, Zion or RJ’s fault. That is Cam Reddish’s fault. I’m not taking a stab at him, he has tremendous talent and upside. I’m just pointing out that he’s not a victim.
He will be a great player at the next level because he has the intangibles and physicality of a picture-perfect NBA wing player. On top of that - The NBA believes they can fix/teach/improve shooting and there’s a lot of proof behind that belief.
He averaged 12 FGA per game this year. That’s 1 less attempt than Zion. Within that he averaged 7-8 3PTA per game, to put that in perspective JJ Redick averaged 9 3PTA his senior year. So not getting enough touches and all that crap is not an excuse. His usage and attempts prove that he was a highly included part of the offense. His makes and horrific percentages prove that he didn’t showcase himself properly most nights. That’s not Coach K, Zion or RJ’s fault. That is Cam Reddish’s fault. I’m not taking a stab at him, he has tremendous talent and upside. I’m just pointing out that he’s not a victim.
He will be a great player at the next level because he has the intangibles and physicality of a picture-perfect NBA wing player. On top of that - The NBA believes they can fix/teach/improve shooting and there’s a lot of proof behind that belief.
I think you bring up some good observations. I have a few questions, and i mean them sincerely. If we had made the final 4, would you have asked the same things? Same question if we won it all. If we didn’t have the injury to Zion, would you still bring these up?
Reason i ask those three questions, isn’t to discredit your points, but to bring the whole season into perspective as a whole. As for using Tre correctly. I think he did, actually. Tre has a glaring weakness- shooting. Teams game plan for that. Teams additionally realize that Duke doesn’t shoot the ball well. So, with that they game plan to stop it.
With regards to Cam, he was inconsistent the whole year. You bring up some good points with him understandably deferring, but it’s not like he didn’t get his fair of opportunities or shots. He was just inconsistent in converting. (And this mind you is coming from a huge cam supporter. I hope cam is the best of the three bc of the crap he took on this board.)
K said at the end of the year that Zions injury unintentionally caused the iso ball we saw against MSU. I didn’t really see it against FSU three weeks prior, which is ironic. I did see a team that caused turnovers and got out into transition where this team shined.
To me, could Cams number have been called more? Yes. Despite his true shooting percentages i would have liked to see that bc he was such a weapon. People forget that in the first half of that MSU game he hit an absolutely huge 3 where i thought we would break the game open. If we don’t make moronic TOs and let them back in, we probably aren’t having this conversation.
I always fall back on the fact that it’s just not as black and white as we want to think it is.
I’ve been saying the last 3 years that Coach K hasn’t really coached. We’ve just had talent. He has done slightly more than roll the ball out on the floor. Not much more than that. He has been empowering guys that weren’t the best on the team the last 3 years. Last year he gave Grayson too much leeway and it caught up to us against Kansas at the end of the game. This year I think he misjudged how good Zion really was. That was obvious because of the high usage rate from RJ (who is a great player himself).
I don’t believe he used Tre’s talent enough. Tre was reduced to a corner shooter. He would pass the ball to RJ almost every time down the floor and then move out of the way. Cam played the role he was given. He wasn’t consistent on the 3s but he was consistent playing defense every night. Zion should’ve had the highest usage rate and the other 3 should’ve played around him. We had a point guard that couldn’t shoot the 3 but could make plays and we never ran pick and roll. Hell we never even ran the RJ-Zion PNR that would’ve been UNSTOPPABLE. I hope this 5 out offense is dead.
After the NC State game I said that our offense would benefit from playing P&R. You responded to me by saying that I didn’t understand the coaching style and how things needed to be ran. Then you went on to giving reasonings as to why running P&R would be a disservice to this team. You also said that there was no problem with RJ’s high usage rate and that Coach K allows him to play the way he does because that works best for us.
There’s nothing wrong with stating now that P&R would have been successful. But you don’t get to criticize Coach K when you were totally onboard with everything while it was producing wins.
@timo0402 I think that answers your question for him.
You contradict your own points throughout this post. He misused Zion? How? The guy who averaged 22.5 and 9? His usage rate should have been higher? I’m not sure how much higher it could have been and this team would have still been effective.
A huge gripe people had at the end was that it turned into a pure Zion or RJ iso ball game. If you wanted Tre to be more of a playmaker that would also mean the ball would be in Zions hands less, but you think his usage rate should be higher? Which one is it? You think Cam was misused but acknowledge his inconsistencies and if you wanted him to have a bigger role in the offense, that would i inherently mean Zions usage rate would again go down.
One of the best things about Zions game actually is that he can affect a game without the ball in his hands. I like the idea of the PNR with RJ and Zion, they ran an offense the last three min where Javin would be the screener and either RJ or Zion would make the read and the play. Problem was the rest of the team (Tre and Cam) just became bystanders. If the offense turns to RJ and Zion in the PNR this makes three players nothing but an audience. But I’m sure they would be effective, i just don’t know how efficient it would be.
This season was a tale of two seasons. Pre-February and Post-February. We can all try to be message board basketball gurus here, and it just sounds totally revisionist.
We can all see it, we don’t have to break down pick and roll percentage to know the team we saw in the early winter was incredible, flowed with nice chemistry and everyone from RJ to Jack White (yep Jack White) all were on NBA draft boards. And before someone says “non-conference is easier,” to a degree yes, but that’s also the schedule that lead to Duke playing 4 of the 7 other teams that made the Elite Eight.
Once ACC season got into full swing, injuries happened, Syracuse happened and teams made a much more concerted effort to force Duke into standing and shooting. When Zion went down, it swung even more into a stand and shoot offense. Either way, the teams two greatest strengths, Tre creating on O and the team getting out into transition were non-existent.
Break it down however it makes you feel comfortable, ____ was misused, K doesn’t coach anymore, OAD players can’t learn an offense, but this team showed none of that early in the season and once other teams adjusted better, this team stopped improving. Be it injury, lack of something or whatever other excuses we can make, this team lost it’s strength at the wrong time of year and was still one of the best in the nation. Meh.
We can all see it, we don’t have to break down pick and roll percentage to know the team we saw in the early winter was incredible, flowed with nice chemistry and everyone from RJ to Jack White (yep Jack White) all were on NBA draft boards. And before someone says “non-conference is easier,” to a degree yes, but that’s also the schedule that lead to Duke playing 4 of the 7 other teams that made the Elite Eight.
Once ACC season got into full swing, injuries happened, Syracuse happened and teams made a much more concerted effort to force Duke into standing and shooting. When Zion went down, it swung even more into a stand and shoot offense. Either way, the teams two greatest strengths, Tre creating on O and the team getting out into transition were non-existent.
Break it down however it makes you feel comfortable, ____ was misused, K doesn’t coach anymore, OAD players can’t learn an offense, but this team showed none of that early in the season and once other teams adjusted better, this team stopped improving. Be it injury, lack of something or whatever other excuses we can make, this team lost it’s strength at the wrong time of year and was still one of the best in the nation. Meh.
GREAT POST HOKIE! You laid it out REALLY WELL. Doesnt make the way it ended any easier to accept, but you are totally SPOT ON! OFC
I think you’re getting me mixed up. I’ve always been a fan of the PNR. There’s a running joke on here because all of last year I said we should’ve ran more PNR with Duval. So you’re definitely mistaken.
Absolutely his usage rate should’ve been higher. We used to run the play where we get it to Bagley/Tatum/Ingram/Parker at the elbow and they would go get a bucket. We never did that with Zion this year. I said Zion should’ve had the HIGHEST usage. Let’s not change my words. Just like RJ had the highest usage rate, it should’ve been Zion with the highest. When I say Cam was misused I mean he should’ve gotten some plays called for him. He’s the guy that you run the first play of the game for to make him feel engaged and confident. It would be on Coach K to instruct the others on what to do when that PNR action is going on. Can’t just stand still.
ISO ball could’ve worked better if we actually created mismatches like Houston does consistently. We didn’t do that though.
We thrived off defense and transition early in the season. Everyone knows our halfcourt offense struggled unless we hit 3s. We usually hit shots in the big games though. That stopped as the season went along.
Contradict like a mug! I saw the light as the season went on. Virginia Tech gave everyone the blueprint and it went downhill
You’re a genius!!! I got your back....
Oh well hahaha. I was wrong. Ain’t no shame in admitting I was wrong back then. Offense got figured out and we didn’t adjust. Zion getting hurt probably changed it a little too.
Cam’s scoring numbers around the basket were terrible this year. I can’t see that improving in the NBA where they don’t call fouls on defenders around the rim as much if the defender stays neutral...plus better athletes...etc.
It ultimately comes down to his shot but I’m guessing he’s a specialist just as much in the nba
It ultimately comes down to his shot but I’m guessing he’s a specialist just as much in the nba
There are infinite possibilities, but for starters how about something like: "I don't know. Depends upon a lot of things like where we end up playing after the draft?"
I thought his original answer was fine and could fall under the 'infinite' umbrella.
Cam's only a teenager. I don't see him as a finished product just yet.
Well that makes it real simple. You and I disagree. But you did ask my opinion on the type of answer which I think is fine.
You just defined nearly every single player in the lottery every year.
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