The New Lounge

[GhostOf301]

A coordinated strategy where the U.S., alongside allies, targets sectors where China holds strategic monopolies. Like raw mineral production, lithium-ion batteries production, green energy tech, magnets, semiconductors, pharmaceutical ingredients, and electronics assembly—each of which poses a national security and economic risk to the United States. This is exactly where targeted, coordinated tariffs should come into play.

The goal shouldn’t be to isolate China overnight or bring every job back home—it’s to apply sustained, focused pressure on key sectors while giving U.S. industry time and incentive to rebuild capacity over a realistic, multi-year timeline.

We also need to drop the fairy tale that all manufacturing is coming back. The U.S. economy benefits from global labor dynamics, especially in developing markets—that’s a separate debate, but it’s reality. And even if production returns, most of those jobs will be automated. This is about control of supply chains, not recreating a 20th-century workforce.

A real win means securing our strategic production capabilities without self-inflicted damage.

All of this is great. It is a bit of a stretch, though. I was more asking what could come out of the current strategy than what your strategy would be. For the record, I have no strategy as it is out of my wheelhouse. So I am not coming at you on any kind of way.

 

[Th0r]

All of this is great. It is a bit of a stretch, though. I was more asking what could come out of the current strategy than what your strategy would be. For the record, I have no strategy as it is out of my wheelhouse. So I am not coming at you on any kind of way.

I get what you’re saying.

I just don’t see the current strategy as ultimately being successful. Though I don’t know everything, the rollout and method look too deeply flawed to produce real results. Most Americans have no idea what’s coming down the pipe—this strategy is a time bomb, and the fuse has already been lit. Now we’re just waiting for the explosion.

If this course continues, I think we’re headed for real economic damage. You’ll start to see layoffs ripple through industries that rely on imports—especially smaller manufacturers and suppliers who can’t just absorb these costs. Prices on everyday goods will climb, and not gradually. Consumers will feel it at the register, and demand will slow. Meanwhile, capital investment will freeze up because no one wants to build in uncertainty.

You push prices up and production down at the same time, and what you get is stagflation. We haven’t seen that in decades, but this strategy is laying the groundwork for it in real time. I hope I’m wrong—but right now, nothing about this feels stable or sustainable.

 

[Th0r]

No offense, but where were you @Th0r from 21 thru 24? I get that all of us on the right spent 4 years criticizing Biden. Our country turned into a full on shit show while he was in office. Trump may very well might be making some mistakes. I still think it's a little early to be blasting him, but that's a part of the game. Compared to the last administration though? No one knew who was making decisions while Ol Joe was eating Corn puffs, watching Looney Tunes, and being kept away from the public. There is NO defending that.

Sorry, but I tried reading the above novel, but my eyes glazed over.

Sorry I missed this earlier.

I call balls and strikes as I see them. I haven’t criticized Democrats on this forum because I haven’t had the opportunity since I only recently decided to engage—but I will when it’s warranted. What bothered me most was how the people around Biden seemed determined to shield him from scrutiny and prevent any serious primary challenge. Had he stepped aside after one term like he originally said he would, we would’ve had a real Democratic primary—and maybe a very different outcome.

That said, Democrats currently control none of the three branches. They’re not setting the agenda—Trump and the Republicans are. So until that changes, they own the current state of things, and that’s where my focus is.

I see no reason to rehash the same arguments you guys have been having for years. I’m posting here because I like a good debate—and I’m very good at it. I comment on things I understand, when they matter. And right now, the people in power deserve scrutiny. That’s where I’m coming from.

 

[Dattier]

Just curious what outcome of this strategy you would consider a victory worth celebrating. It seems you already have your conclusions.

"It seems you already have your conclusions," says the guy who has nothing to offer but memes p3ning libs.
Faced with solid analysis from someone you have no established knowledge of to base a personal attack on, you hem and haw and resort to "wuh-wuh-wuh-well, if you could do better, why aren't YOU President?"

This @Th0r dude couldn't have shown up at a better time... OH, but even THAT is part of your coloring playbook... see next post...

 

[Dattier]

No offense, but where were you @Th0r from 21 thru 24? I get that all of us on the right spent 4 years criticizing Biden. Our country turned into a full on shit show while he was in office. Trump may very well might be making some mistakes. I still think it's a little early to be blasting him, but that's a part of the game. Compared to the last administration though? No one knew who was making decisions while Ol Joe was eating Corn puffs, watching Looney Tunes, and being kept away from the public. There is NO defending that.

Sorry, but I tried reading the above novel, but my eyes glazed over.

Uh-huh. No response to any actual content at hand, so you try to raise suspicions about the person behind the posts that have you so gobsmacked.

Bu-bu-but President Trump deserves more time to make mistakes while claiming everything he does is amaze-balls!

Hawhaw! Let's make jokes about the last President to make yerself feel gooder about the spectacle de merde you voted for.

And reading a novel makes your eyes glaze over. Did you mean to say that part out loud? Why not just admit that intellectual, logical, well-supported positions make you blow a gasket and you just can't keep up?

 

[KDSTONE]

Uh-huh. No response to any actual content at hand, so you try to raise suspicions about the person behind the posts that have you so gobsmacked.

Bu-bu-but President Trump deserves more time to make mistakes while claiming everything he does is amaze-balls!

Hawhaw! Let's make jokes about the last President to make yerself feel gooder about the spectacle de merde you voted for.

And reading a novel makes your eyes glaze over. Did you mean to say that part out loud? Why not just admit that intellectual, logical, well-supported positions make you blow a gasket and you just can't keep up?

Not to put words in Mac’s mouth, but we’ve all made the point that Thor’s concerns are well argued and as such duly noted, but that it’s too early to label Trump’s moves as mistakes. Thor has laid out a strong case as to why they will be proven to be mistakes.
Raise suspicions about the person. I’ve noted the timing of Thor’s arrival and if I were more cynical in nature I might find said timing convenient, but he brings a lot of knowledge and civility to the table so that outweighs any initial
concerns I might have had.
Again, you keep asserting that everyone is a-ok with all of Trumps moves on the economy That’s not a fair summary of our posts the past month or so. Perhaps it’s our predisposition to mostly give Trump the benefit of the doubt, or maybe Thor will be mostly proven correct in time.
Either way, it’s awfully early to be doing victory laps.

 

[KDSTONE]

Uh-huh. No response to any actual content at hand, so you try to raise suspicions about the person behind the posts that have you so gobsmacked.

Bu-bu-but President Trump deserves more time to make mistakes while claiming everything he does is amaze-balls!

Hawhaw! Let's make jokes about the last President to make yerself feel gooder about the spectacle de merde you voted for.

And reading a novel makes your eyes glaze over. Did you mean to say that part out loud? Why not just admit that intellectual, logical, well-supported positions make you blow a gasket and you just can't keep up?

Amaze-balls. Some of the sh- you post reminds me of that scene in Mean Girls when Regina George tells the girl from Party of 5: “ Quit trying to make Fetch happen. It’s not gonna happen”.

 

[KDSTONE]

I get what you’re saying.

I just don’t see the current strategy as ultimately being successful. Though I don’t know everything, the rollout and method look too deeply flawed to produce real results. Most Americans have no idea what’s coming down the pipe—this strategy is a time bomb, and the fuse has already been lit. Now we’re just waiting for the explosion.

If this course continues, I think we’re headed for real economic damage. You’ll start to see layoffs ripple through industries that rely on imports—especially smaller manufacturers and suppliers who can’t just absorb these costs. Prices on everyday goods will climb, and not gradually. Consumers will feel it at the register, and demand will slow. Meanwhile, capital investment will freeze up because no one wants to build in uncertainty.

You push prices up and production down at the same time, and what you get is stagflation. We haven’t seen that in decades, but this strategy is laying the groundwork for it in real time. I hope I’m wrong—but right now, nothing about this feels stable or sustainable.

Tightened immigration will prevent mass layoffs is one theory.

Trump tariffs to increase unemployment, but mass layoffs unlikely | Fox Business

Economists at Allianz forecast Trump's tariffs could negatively impact the U.S. economy, increase unemployment, cause higher inflation, and decrease exports due to retaliation.

www.foxbusiness.com

 

[GhostOf301]

"It seems you already have your conclusions," says the guy who has nothing to offer but memes p3ning libs.
Faced with solid analysis from someone you have no established knowledge of to base a personal attack on, you hem and haw and resort to "wuh-wuh-wuh-well, if you could do better, why aren't YOU President?"

This @Th0r dude couldn't have shown up at a better time... OH, but even THAT is part of your coloring playbook... see next post...

You're not relevant. We are discussing disagreements with a level headed and non condescending, douche, who is far more intelligent than you.

Wish you well.

 

[Mac9192]

Amaze-balls. Some of the sh- you post reminds me of that scene in Mean Girls when Regina George tells the girl from Party of 5: “ Quit trying to make Fetch happen. It’s not gonna happen”.

Ol @Dattier whines about how he’s treated here, then comes back to post more of his usual garbage.

He’s like the kid that runs his mouth, and gets his ass kicked. The guy stops, but he decides to run his mouth again, which then the guy goes back to pummeling him some more.

 

[Th0r]

Tightened immigration will prevent mass layoffs is one theory.

Trump tariffs to increase unemployment, but mass layoffs unlikely | Fox Business

Economists at Allianz forecast Trump's tariffs could negatively impact the U.S. economy, increase unemployment, cause higher inflation, and decrease exports due to retaliation.

www.foxbusiness.com

The theory that tight immigration and labor shortages could help delay layoffs makes sense to me, especially in the short term. I agree it’s possible that employers might hold onto workers longer than usual given how hard it’s been to fill positions in recent years.

Out of curiosity, I looked up the rest of Allianz’s forecast. They’re projecting just 0.8% GDP growth for the U.S. this year, with a mild recession stretching from Q1 through Q3, driven by policy disruptions and tariff escalation. That lines up with what you’d expect when rising costs and uncertainty start weighing down the economy—and honestly, I’ve kind of figured Q3 would be when the crap hits the fan anyway.

I genuinely hope Allianz is right and we avoid a wave of job losses. But with inflation already up and growth slowing, unemployment is the last missing piece. If that starts to move, we’re not talking about risk—we’re living stagflation. At this point, the pieces are on the board. It’s just a matter of when and where they fall.

 

[Th0r]

Just to expand on what I said earlier—one of my more specific concerns is how these tariffs are affecting small businesses. Electronics like phones and computers might be exempt for now, but most of the products small retailers depend on—tools, packaging, textiles—aren’t.

In towns like mine, where the cost of living is high and the economy relies heavily on tourism, that hits hard. A lot of our local shops, like others across the country, source their inventory from China. Now we’re seeing a real slowdown in international bookings, and people are starting to worry. Stricter visa policies, rising tariffs, and global tensions are all playing a role.

This isn’t some distant policy debate—it’s showing up right here in everyday life. That’s why I’ve been speaking so directly about this. These are small, seasonal businesses with tight margins. They can’t absorb a sudden 50% spike in costs. And those are the jobs I’m most concerned about in the short term.

 

[KDSTONE]

Just to expand on what I said earlier—one of my more specific concerns is how these tariffs are affecting small businesses. Electronics like phones and computers might be exempt for now, but most of the products small retailers depend on—tools, packaging, textiles—aren’t.

In towns like mine, where the cost of living is high and the economy relies heavily on tourism, that hits hard. A lot of our local shops, like others across the country, source their inventory from China. Now we’re seeing a real slowdown in international bookings, and people are starting to worry. Stricter visa policies, rising tariffs, and global tensions are all playing a role.

This isn’t some distant policy debate—it’s showing up right here in everyday life. That’s why I’ve been speaking so directly about this. These are small, seasonal businesses with tight margins. They can’t absorb a sudden 50% spike in costs. And those are the jobs I’m most concerned about in the short term.

This article seems to cover the concerns of many small businesses very well. Kudos to Fox Business for covering it, but I doubt Hannity or Gutfeld will discuss it anytime soon.

Trump tariffs weighing on small business owners | Fox Business

Small businesses are worried about their survival as President Donald Trump's tariffs on China escalate, with U.S. duties on Beijing now totaling 145%.

www.foxbusiness.com

 

[Dattier]

Amaze-balls. Some of the sh- you post reminds me of that scene in Mean Girls when Regina George tells the girl from Party of 5: “ Quit trying to make Fetch happen. It’s not gonna happen”.

You know, you can just respond once to the same post. It makes it seem less like you were stewing over what I said, then came back for another retort.
Yeah, I used that word in the sentence where I was mocking @Mac9192 . Glad you caught the deliberate idiocy, even if you didn't get the context. Mean Girls? Is that a tv show?

 

[Dattier]

Ol @Dattier whines about how he’s treated here, then comes back to post more of his usual garbage.

He’s like the kid that runs his mouth, and gets his ass kicked. The guy stops, but he decides to run his mouth again, which then the guy goes back to pummeling him some more.

You seen Cool Hand Luke?

 

[Dattier]

You're not relevant. We are discussing disagreements with a level headed and non condescending, douche, who is far more intelligent than you.

Wish you well.

He's definitely more knowledgable on tariffs and economy than I am. He's also more patient and willing to put up with crap than I am.

You're not actually contributing anything to the conversation. Th0r is basically giving you a master class while you sit there slackjawed, occasionally sniping at him because he makes you feel inferior.

 

[GhostOf301]

He's definitely more knowledgable on tariffs and economy than I am. He's also more patient and willing to put up with crap than I am.

You're not actually contributing anything to the conversation. Th0r is basically giving you a master class while you sit there slackjawed, occasionally sniping at him because he makes you feel inferior.

You're still here? Run along.

 

[KDSTONE]

You know, you can just respond once to the same post. It makes it seem less like you were stewing over what I said, then came back for another retort.
Yeah, I used that word in the sentence where I was mocking @Mac9192 . Glad you caught the deliberate idiocy, even if you didn't get the context. Mean Girls? Is that a tv show?

No one stews about your posts. It’s comic relief at this point.
Mean Girls is an iconic film that came out in 04 I think. One of the biggest hits of the decade. Not really my cup of tea, but it def had its moments. So we can add pop culture to the economy and foreign policy to topics you know little about.
You’ve lost your fastball.

 

[KDSTONE]

He's definitely more knowledgable on tariffs and economy than I am. He's also more patient and willing to put up with crap than I am.

You're not actually contributing anything to the conversation. Th0r is basically giving you a master class while you sit there slackjawed, occasionally sniping at him because he makes you feel inferior.

This is what you’ve been reduced to. Cant stand to see posters from different sides of the political fence getting along, so you’re trying to stir up resentment against Th0r when you’re not playing fanboy Sad. What are you contributing to the conversation? Besides ad hominem attacks and ill conceived attempts at humor?

 

[KDSTONE]

You know, you can just respond once to the same post. It makes it seem less like you were stewing over what I said, then came back for another retort.
Yeah, I used that word in the sentence where I was mocking @Mac9192 . Glad you caught the deliberate idiocy, even if you didn't get the context. Mean Girls? Is that a tv show?

Yeh I know 😉

 

[Mac9192]

Without @Dattier , this thread would be dull. His value is of entertainment purposes only. Now @Th0r seems to be versed on the subject of tariffs. He appears to be a smart guy, and not afraid to tell you that either. Time will tell whether his complaints are valid. Personally, I think it's a lot bigger than what he grasps. But he gives his all anyway.

 

[KDSTONE]

Without @Dattier , this thread would be dull. His value is of entertainment purposes only. Now @Th0r seems to be versed on the subject of tariffs. He appears to be a smart guy, and not afraid to tell you that either. Time will tell whether his complaints are valid. Personally, I think it's a lot bigger than what he grasps. But he gives his all anyway.

What loons like @Dattier don't get is that we aren't saying Trump is always right. There is some concern from us. Which is a far cry from what we experienced from him the previous four years. Poor guy is nothing but an extension of left wing news. He could sure tell you how many indictments Trump had on him, but couldn't give an honest take on Ol Joe's leadership.

Whether Trump’s policies as a whole will be positive can’t be determined yet, but small businesses are already feeling the pain.
Th0r predicted this from the outset and I acknowledged it by posting a link from Fox Business that supported his concerns almost verbatim.
This type of informational give and take was all but impossible with Datt’s combative style.
Hopefully he’ll use this as a teachable moment and we’ll all come out in a better place.

 

[Mac9192]

Whether Trump’s policies as a whole will be positive can’t be determined yet, but small businesses are already feeling the pain.
Th0r predicted this from the outset and I acknowledged it by posting a link from Fox Business that supported his concerns almost verbatim.
This type of informational give and take was all but impossible with Datt’s combative style.
Hopefully he’ll use this as a teachable moment and we’ll all come out in a better place.

We all knew that there might be some tougher times due to the tariffs. Just hope it’s short term. Trump has two years, and knows this.

On the part about Datt using this as a teachable moment and coming out better, please don't wager any money on it.

 

[Dattier]

Personally, I think it's a lot bigger than what he grasps. But he gives his all anyway.

🤣🤣🤣
Says the guy who can't demonstrate a grasp on any of it.

 

[smashmouth5]

Didn't the President say there would be some pain to start but just hang tough. It was going to take big changes to try and turn a behemoth around that was spiralling out of control.

 

[Dattier]

This type of informational give and take was all but impossible with Datt’s combative style.
Hopefully he’ll use this as a teachable moment and we’ll all come out in a better place.

Currently, Th0r is ignoring a lot of passive-aggressiveness from y'all. I'm not the one who started the combative tone here. I just stopped letting it slide, and now here we are.

And I was just messing with you about Mean Girls. I know it well. I actually think it's a really good movie, a classic of its genre.

 

[Th0r]

To be fair, I’ll take a swing at the Democratic Party too — they’ve earned it. I understand not everyone will see these issues the way I do, and that’s okay.

Since Trump’s first win, Democrats have been scared to run on what they actually believe. Instead of setting the terms, they let Trump dictate the battlefield. His superpower isn’t policy — or thinking — it’s narrative control. He provokes, they react.

That fear shaped the 2020 nomination. Biden wasn’t a bold choice; he was a reaction. Party leaders decided only an establishment figure could win. It wasn’t about inspiring people — it was about playing it safe. And while Biden won, the deeper problems never got fixed.

The Democratic establishment has lost the plot. They’re tied to the same oligarchs who hijacked the Republican Party — and Trump. Different team colors, same sponsors. Real power won’t come from recycled consultants or 80-year-old figureheads. It’s time for Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi, and the old guard to step aside.

Democrats keep winning because Republicans keep lighting themselves on fire. That’s not a strategy. Fear doesn’t build movements — it burns people out. Without a real vision, turnout collapses.

Writing off rural America is political malpractice. Rural and urban communities face the same collapse and healthcare crises. Some Democrats are waking up — showing up in “Trump country” and realizing people are ready to listen. That instinct needs to become the rule, and not the exception.

And despite the headlines, the situation isn’t hopeless. Republicans control government — but barely. This was a close election. Democrats still have a real path — if they get their crap together, and fight for something bigger than just not being Trump.

They also can’t keep ignoring the media battlefield. The old media structure is dead, and most so-called journalists are too afraid to challenge power anymore. Meanwhile, right-wing media built an entire ecosystem around constant engagement. Democrats neglected podcasts, long-form interviews, and alternative platforms for too long. You can’t win hearts and minds if you never show up. You have to meet people where they are — not where you wish they were.

The focus should be sharp: rebuild the American Dream for working families and defend the rights that make it possible. Economic dignity and civil rights aren’t separate fights — they’re the same one.

Trump’s tariff policy has cracked the door wide open. The opportunity is sitting right there. The only question is: what will they do with it?

We’re stuck with a two-party system for now — and the country is better off when both of those parties actually try to meaningfully solve real problems, which hasn’t happened for a long time.

 

[Th0r]

Didn't the President say there would be some pain to start but just hang tough. It was going to take big changes to try and turn a behemoth around that was spiralling out of control.

It’s one thing to talk about “some pain” in theory—it’s a whole other thing to deal with the people actually living it. It’s not easy to look someone in the eye who’s poured their life savings and years of work into building a small business and tell them their sacrifice is just part of the plan. These aren’t just numbers on a chart—they’re real livelihoods being put at risk.

 

[Mac9192]

It’s one thing to talk about “some pain” in theory—it’s a whole other thing to deal with the people actually living it. It’s not easy to look someone in the eye who’s poured their life savings and years of work into building a small business and tell them their sacrifice is just part of the plan. These aren’t just numbers on a chart—they’re real livelihoods being put at risk.

A lot of people have been living tough for a while, it just gets noticed and harped on as soon as a Republican takes charge. No way a Republican could have gotten away with a vegetable as President. This doesn’t get talked about, but it’s true.

 

[Th0r]

A lot of people have been living tough for a while, it just gets noticed and harped on as soon as a Republican takes charge. No way a Republican could have gotten away with a vegetable as President. This doesn’t get talked about, but it’s true.

I disagree with that assessment. It was obviously getting talked about—Democrats were bludgeoned over it in 2022 and 2024. They lost because voters didn’t think they had real answers for the economic pain people were feeling. And now Trump is making the same mistake. You can’t just ask people to tough it out without a serious plan to make things better. Eventually, voters stop giving you the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Mac9192]

I disagree with that assessment. It was obviously getting talked about—Democrats were bludgeoned over it in 2022 and 2024. They lost because voters didn’t think they had real answers for the economic pain people were feeling. And now Trump is making the same mistake. You can’t just ask people to tough it out without a serious plan to make things better. Eventually, voters stop giving you the benefit of the doubt.

We are just gonna have to agree to disagree. I don’t think you can snap your fingers and fix things. There’s going to be some fallout, you just hope it’s short term. Our country has been in a mess for a long time.

And no the mid terms weren’t the bloodbath people on the right thought they’d be. It wasn’t until late 23, early 24 that people started to wake up.

 

[Th0r]

We are just gonna have to agree to disagree. I don’t think you can snap your fingers and fix things. There’s going to be some fallout, you just hope it’s short term. Our country has been in a mess for a long time.

And no the mid terms weren’t the bloodbath people on the right thought they’d be. It wasn’t until late 23, early 24 that people started to wake up.

Fair enough—we can agree to disagree. But I’m not expecting anyone to snap their fingers and fix everything. What I am saying is that when you roll out a policy that creates immediate economic instability, especially for small businesses, there needs to be a serious plan to soften the blow and show a clear path forward. Without that, the “short-term” pain risks becoming something much worse.

And really, we haven’t even seen the full impact yet—it’s still working its way down the supply chain.

Honestly, I hope your version is right.

 

[KDSTONE]

To be fair, I’ll take a swing at the Democratic Party too — they’ve earned it. I understand not everyone will see these issues the way I do, and that’s okay.

Since Trump’s first win, Democrats have been scared to run on what they actually believe. Instead of setting the terms, they let Trump dictate the battlefield. His superpower isn’t policy — or thinking — it’s narrative control. He provokes, they react.

That fear shaped the 2020 nomination. Biden wasn’t a bold choice; he was a reaction. Party leaders decided only an establishment figure could win. It wasn’t about inspiring people — it was about playing it safe. And while Biden won, the deeper problems never got fixed.

The Democratic establishment has lost the plot. They’re tied to the same oligarchs who hijacked the Republican Party — and Trump. Different team colors, same sponsors. Real power won’t come from recycled consultants or 80-year-old figureheads. It’s time for Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi, and the old guard to step aside.

Democrats keep winning because Republicans keep lighting themselves on fire. That’s not a strategy. Fear doesn’t build movements — it burns people out. Without a real vision, turnout collapses.

Writing off rural America is political malpractice. Rural and urban communities face the same collapse and healthcare crises. Some Democrats are waking up — showing up in “Trump country” and realizing people are ready to listen. That instinct needs to become the rule, and not the exception.

And despite the headlines, the situation isn’t hopeless. Republicans control government — but barely. This was a close election. Democrats still have a real path — if they get their crap together, and fight for something bigger than just not being Trump.

They also can’t keep ignoring the media battlefield. The old media structure is dead, and most so-called journalists are too afraid to challenge power anymore. Meanwhile, right-wing media built an entire ecosystem around constant engagement. Democrats neglected podcasts, long-form interviews, and alternative platforms for too long. You can’t win hearts and minds if you never show up. You have to meet people where they are — not where you wish they were.

The focus should be sharp: rebuild the American Dream for working families and defend the rights that make it possible. Economic dignity and civil rights aren’t separate fights — they’re the same one.

Trump’s tariff policy has cracked the door wide open. The opportunity is sitting right there. The only question is: what will they do with it?

We’re stuck with a two-party system for now — and the country is better off when both of those parties actually try to meaningfully solve real problems, which hasn’t happened for a long

In the fourth par. from the bottom, you touched on the Legacy media’s role in Kamala’s loss. Over the years, the msm has become so blatantly one sided that it backfired on the Dems in 24. The “Let’s all pretend we have stars in our eyes” for Kamala strategy was so over the top, so stomach churning that Independents and media savvy young voters tuned it out entirely. The rise of Joe Rogan and others didn’t occur in a vacuum.
Joe Scarborough bleating about this is the best version of Joe Biden.. EVER just months prior to the fateful debate
The msm covering these sham political trials as if they were the Nuremberg trials or Watergate.
The MSM has no one to blame but themselves for their steep slide into oblivion
That said, if Harris weren’t such a uniquely unprepared, untalented candidate, the election would have been neck and neck imho. How did this lack of preparedness manifest itself in a real way? Look no further than the View. Friendly, sycophantic environment. What wd you do differently than Biden? By this point in the campaign she should have been able to answer that in her sleep.
Can’t think of anything right off hand let the voters know this is not a serious person. Biggest moment of the campaign.

 

[KDSTONE]

I’ve heard that if Trump’s policies attract as much foreign capital as he is touting, the dollar will appreciate and our trade deficits will worsen across the board.
Other than reducing our dependence on China for imports essential to our natl security is having a trade deficit even a bad thing anymore? Or is this just an outdated way of looking at the issue? Bringing manufacturing jobs back sounds like a good thing, but will it be worth it if the plants are ( if lucky) barely up and running when a Dem comes in 28 and knee jerk throws out all of Trumps policies, good and bad, like we saw in 2021?

 

[GhostOf301]

I'm not the one who started the combative tone here. I just stopped letting it slide.

As a narcissist, you are likely not to see your condescending attitude as being combative. So I believe that you believe that you aren't ever the one who starts with the combative tone. Fact is everyone (regular) here has shown the ability to remain civil through disagreements except you. You have long had a habit of insulting others without provocation and then play the victim when it gets returned back to you. I have made it a point to refrain from the petty bullshit with you for a while. Even through your mockery and snootiness. And let's not pretend that you have ever been one to let anything that offends you, slide. It's not in your blood. Not a terrible thing, but you should just own it.

 

[Th0r]

In the fourth par. from the bottom, you touched on the Legacy media’s role in Kamala’s loss. Over the years, the msm has become so blatantly one sided that it backfired on the Dems in 24. The “Let’s all pretend we have stars in our eyes” for Kamala strategy was so over the top, so stomach churning that Independents and media savvy young voters tuned it out entirely. The rise of Joe Rogan and others didn’t occur in a vacuum.
Joe Scarborough bleating about this is the best version of Joe Biden.. EVER just months prior to the fateful debate
The msm covering these sham political trials as if they were the Nuremberg trials or Watergate.
The MSM has no one to blame but themselves for their steep slide into oblivion
That said, if Harris weren’t such a uniquely unprepared, untalented candidate, the election would have been neck and neck imho. How did this lack of preparedness manifest itself in a real way? Look no further than the View. Friendly, sycophantic environment. What wd you do differently than Biden? By this point in the campaign she should have been able to answer that in her sleep.
Can’t think of anything right off hand let the voters know this is not a serious person. Biggest moment of the campaign.

I don’t think it’s fair to blame Harris for how this played out. She wasn’t put in a good situation by the party. Biden had indicated early on that he would likely step down after one term—but he didn’t. Without a real Democratic primary, there was no chance for alternatives to emerge. By the time he exited, Harris was the only candidate with the infrastructure ready to go. It wasn’t about excitement—it was survival.

At the time, the logic made sense: Biden was seen as the “safe” choice—the one person who had already beaten Trump. But in hindsight, that assumption turned out to be badly flawed, and the party had no real backup plan when it mattered. This all goes back to that underlying fear.

The June debate was a wake-up call for a lot of mainstream Democrats. I don’t think many truly grasped Biden’s decline until they saw it live. At that point, rallying behind Harris wasn’t about hype—it was the only viable move if Democrats wanted to stay in the race.

I also agree with your points about the media. Trump exposed how badly the press is built for this era. But it’s bigger than bias—it’s structural. The same oligarchs who fund political campaigns also own much of our media and communications infrastructure. Just look at 60 Minutes: a senior producer resigns over “narrative control” while the parent company chases a merger that still needs government approval. You may hate 60 Minutes, but imagine if it were a program you agreed with. When survival depends on pleasing regulators, honest journalism becomes impossible—and trust collapses.

Harris didn’t create the situation she inherited. The real failure was systemic. It wasn’t just media or messaging—it was underlying economic issues voters didn’t feel were improving. Plenty of Trump voters genuinely like Trump, no doubt about that. But there’s also a big group that puts up with the chaos because they associate him—rightly or wrongly—with economic prosperity. They’re not voting for drama; they’re voting for a better financial future. Part of earning people’s votes is being honest about why you lost—and Democrats must show they’re serious about fixing it.

 

[denverexpat]

I disagree with that assessment. It was obviously getting talked about—Democrats were bludgeoned over it in 2022 and 2024. They lost because voters didn’t think they had real answers for the economic pain people were feeling. And now Trump is making the same mistake. You can’t just ask people to tough it out without a serious plan to make things better. Eventually, voters stop giving you the benefit of the doubt.

I think you are misreading the plan. Small business, which accounts for 85% of the businesses in the US, were crushed by regulation and tax under Biden, and did not see any way to improvement... bankruptcies exploded. Trump is looking to cut regulations, lower their tax burden, and help promote US small business growth by reversing decades of unfair trade practices across the globe. If you built a business on cheap chinese imports then I'm afraid you are part of the problem and have the choiceto adjust and embrace US supply chains or not. This imbalance has been allowed, by both sides i may add, for decades and has hidden in the shadows..much like the waste of our tax dollars...and it will take a period of readjustment to get healthy. Patience is in short supply these days and it isnt help by the fear mongering of all the so called experts on the left shouting about the sky falling. Decades of imbalance won't be fixed in a month, two months, etc...it will take time...but we will emerge healthier as a trading nation if we stay the course..imo...as a small business owner

 

[Th0r]

I’ve heard that if Trump’s policies attract as much foreign capital as he is touting, the dollar will appreciate and our trade deficits will worsen across the board.
Other than reducing our dependence on China for imports essential to our natl security is having a trade deficit even a bad thing anymore? Or is this just an outdated way of looking at the issue? Bringing manufacturing jobs back sounds like a good thing, but will it be worth it if the plants are ( if lucky) barely up and running when a Dem comes in 28 and knee jerk throws out all of Trumps policies, good and bad, like we saw in 2021?

You’re asking the right question, and it gets to the core problem with Trump’s strategy: it’s all executive action, no congressional buy-in. That makes the entire thing fragile. The next president can reverse it with the stroke of a pen—just like Trump did in 2017 and Biden did in 2021.

That kind of instability makes it hard for businesses to commit. Why build a plant that takes years to pay off if the economic foundation could be gone in four?

Trade deficits also aren’t the crisis they’re made out to be. It depends on what we’re importing and what we’re getting in return. If we’re bringing in low-cost goods while exporting high-value services and attracting capital, it can reflect a strong economy.

The national debt and the deficit are real problems—and we should be working to get both under control. But you can’t do that while your signature legislation is a massive tax cut that will certainly add to the deficit. And yes, we always hear about cutting government waste—but most of what’s getting cut doesn’t even move the needle. If you’re serious, you have to be willing to look at defense spending and other major drivers.

Another thing that frustrates me about the current strategy is that Trump, above all people, should understand how the bond market, interest rates, and capital flows work. If you look at how he historically managed his businesses—constantly watching debt, refinancing, and leveraging lower rates—he should know better than anyone how sensitive long-term investments are to financial stability. Yet the way these tariffs have been rolled out completely ignores the signals and realities that markets react to.

All of this flows together. Trade policy, fiscal policy, business investment—they’re all connected. You can’t fix one piece while ignoring the others. Real economic strategy takes consistency, seriousness, and buy-in across the system. Otherwise, it’s just another thing that gets reversed the next time the White House changes hands.

 

[Dattier]

As a narcissist, you are likely not to see your condescending attitude as being combative. So I believe that you believe that you aren't ever the one who starts with the combative tone. Fact is everyone (regular) here has shown the ability to remain civil through disagreements except you. You have long had a habit of insulting others without provocation and then play the victim when it gets returned back to you. I have made it a point to refrain from the petty bullshit with you for a while. Even through your mockery and snootiness. And let's not pretend that you have ever been one to let anything that offends you, slide. It's not in your blood. Not a terrible thing, but you should just own it.

I'm not a narcissist. I just have a better vocabulary than you. I'm entirely capable of being civil, as you well know.

 

[KDSTONE]

You’re asking the right question, and it gets to the core problem with Trump’s strategy: it’s all executive action, no congressional buy-in. That makes the entire thing fragile. The next president can reverse it with the stroke of a pen—just like Trump did in 2017 and Biden did in 2021.

That kind of instability makes it hard for businesses to commit. Why build a plant that takes years to pay off if the economic foundation could be gone in four?

Trade deficits also aren’t the crisis they’re made out to be. It depends on what we’re importing and what we’re getting in return. If we’re bringing in low-cost goods while exporting high-value services and attracting capital, it can reflect a strong economy.

The national debt and the deficit are real problems—and we should be working to get both under control. But you can’t do that while your signature legislation is a massive tax cut that will certainly add to the deficit. And yes, we always hear about cutting government waste—but most of what’s getting cut doesn’t even move the needle. If you’re serious, you have to be willing to look at defense spending and other major drivers.

Another thing that frustrates me about the current strategy is that Trump, above all people, should understand how the bond market, interest rates, and capital flows work. If you look at how he historically managed his businesses—constantly watching debt, refinancing, and leveraging lower rates—he should know better than anyone how sensitive long-term investments are to financial stability. Yet the way these tariffs have been rolled out completely ignores the signals and realities that markets react to.

All of this flows together. Trade policy, fiscal policy, business investment—they’re all connected. You can’t fix one piece while ignoring the others. Real economic strategy takes consistency, seriousness, and buy-in across the system. Otherwise, it’s just another thing that gets reversed the next time the White House changes hands.

How has the executive branch over the years, illustrated vividly the past couple of months, usurped Congress’ ability to regulate our nation’s trade and commerce? The Commerce Clause of the US Constitution seems clear. How did we get here. Congressional approval and buy in would outlast the whims and knee jerk decisions our recent Pres have been known for and give our nation a chance for long term manuf growth and consistency, rather than the harem skarem approach we’re seeing now. Are checks and balances even taken seriously in DC anymore?