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Next season?

T

The Dude#

Devils Illustrated Hall of Famer
Feb 5, 2003
15,963
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First off, congrats on a sensational season and a magnificent run in the tourney. Just a great addition to the trophy case.

Now, next season: what is the line-up going to look like? I know you guys lose a ton, but who is coming in that can step right in? Does Jefferson have another year? Any 4th year transfers?

Thanks in advance.
 
First of all thanks, it was a great season.

Hopefully Thornton reclassifys or we get Jamal Murray. If we get one of those two we should be solid next year.

1.Thornton/Murray
2.Allen
3.Jones or Kennard
4.Jefferson
5.Jeter

that would be my guess.
 
Kennard and Allen on the wings could be interesting, exciting to watch.
 
Originally posted by The Dude#:
Kennard and Allen on the wings could be interesting, exciting to watch.
Click to expand...
^This. It will be very important to get a true PG signed, so that these two can stay on the wings. A PG that can run the offense the way K wants it run.
Hopefully, Thornton will reclassify and sign with Duke. If he does, I don't think there will be a need for any pity parties for Duke next year!
Go Duke!!


JC-OFC
 
Well it has been proven that eight is enough so if we can get Thornton then we have our eight!
 
I would say obviously that expectations for next season should be tempered. At this point in time, I think a Sweet 16 appearance would be considered a legitimate achievement. Don't mind it, considering they won it all this year.
 
I really like Thornton, he's amazing. But I gotta say this Murray kid looks like an animal. He's tough!
 
Also still have a chance for Ingram. So if we got him and one of the points guards, I think we would but ok.
 
If I was a top-flight PG, I would be chomping at the bit to come start day one for the defending national champs.

JMO.
 
Originally posted by wcu1113:
If I was a top-flight PG, I would be chomping at the bit to come start day one for the defending national champs.

JMO.
Click to expand...
Absolutely. That has to be an extremely appealing scenario for a PG.

If Duke adds two out of the group of Thornton/Murray/Ingram (which is very likely) and Allen can become a double-figure scorer next year (also very likely) Duke will be just fine.

None of the interior options jump off the page like an Okafor, but a four-man rotation of Jefferson/Jeter/Plumlee/Obi is pretty solid and diverse.
 
Huffy, im not ready to say it is that likely that we get 2 of those 3. First off Ingram is 50/50 at best, gun to my head i think UNC is the call, but who knows. That's legit just a guess. No one knows what Murray will do and it is so early for the interest with him we'll have to wait and see. DT is a real question- does he reclass? if he does and commits we wont get murray, if he does not reclass, then Murray is an option. So to get two of the three its either DT and BI or Murray and BI. Won't be DT and Murray.
 
I'd wait to ask this question at the end of the month. At this point, we're either going to have some serious problems or have a pretty good team. The PG position is obviously the most worrisome, but Ingram could also help us be more adaptable to the opponent (b/c he offers some position flexibility at the 3/4 against smaller teams) and gives us an additional scoring punch to take some of the pressure off of Grayson and Kennard.

While I don't think there's anyone out there who can replace Tyus's consistent big game moxy (really never seen anything like it at Duke since the days of Laettner et al.), I do think Thornton's capable of replicating Tyus's production-level from last year. He's a very, very good prospect.

This post was edited on 4/15 12:30 PM by aah555
 
Originally posted by CatcherForLife6:
anyone hear anything new on Ingram?
Click to expand...
No, but UNC folks seem a bit more optimistic about their chances with Jaylen Brown. As much as people have discussed the impact of Tokoto / Winslow on Ingram, wouldn't be shocked if the real hold up for Ingram is the possibility of Brown to UNC.

As many have said, I think there's little doubt that Ingram's preference would be to be a star one-and-done player at UNC. The problem, however, is that the current makeup of UNC's roster makes that difficult -- and Brown committing would make it virtually impossible.
 
Front-court scares me a bit. The good thing is that they all defend well and can rebound. Obi will be the obvious wild-card. If he can play, this team becomes a lot more dangerous. The problem is that the team will be missing a legit "3" that it had this year in Winslow.
 
Originally posted by timo0402:
Huffy, im not ready to say it is that likely that we get 2 of those 3. First off Ingram is 50/50 at best, gun to my head i think UNC is the call, but who knows. That's legit just a guess. No one knows what Murray will do and it is so early for the interest with him we'll have to wait and see. DT is a real question- does he reclass? if he does and commits we wont get murray, if he does not reclass, then Murray is an option. So to get two of the three its either DT and BI or Murray and BI. Won't be DT and Murray.
Click to expand...
I know Duke won't get both PGs, but I feel certain they will get one. Ingram is the wild card. His high school has the UNC lineage that he is probably inundated with (Stackhouse, Bullock), but Duke offers a different, and I think vastly better scenario for him specifically. I'm optimistic for Duke for a few reasons, primarily that if he really wanted to commit to UNC, he could/would have done that already. They weren't in Duke's situation where they were waiting on decisions from guys who play his position. He knew all along who they would be. Tokota's decision was unexpected, but not a huge wrinkle in that equation I wouldn't think. If he was set on wearing baby blue, what has he been waiting on?

Also, K has an indisputable track record with guys like him (like-sized combo-ish forwards). Grant Hill, Chris Carrawell, Roshown McCleod, Shane Battier, Luol Deng, Kyle Singler, Jabari Parker, etc. Before the reactionaries get me, I'm not saying Ingram is/will be as good as any of those guys, or that all those guys are the same player, but I think you can see my point. Now, obviously, whether an 18 year old is willing to see it is a different story.
 
Matt Jones ,Kennard and Allen will put pressure on teams because all three can drive and shoot. They all are about 6' 5 and can play several positions. I hope we can sign a forward to off set Winslow.
 
Originally posted by wcu1113:
If I was a top-flight PG, I would be chomping at the bit to come start day one for the defending national champs.

JMO.
Click to expand...
I'd be chomping at the bit to dish out passes to guys like Allen, Kennard, and Matt. Imagine the assist totals you could rack up with those scorers on the floor. I agree with other posters in this thread that watching Allen and Kennard on the floor at the same time will be a fun time. Add Matt into that mix and you have 3 scorers that can handle the ball pretty well and drain the long ball.

This post was edited on 4/15 11:25 PM by dbav
 
What might really help Duke recruiting would be some sign, I haven't seen any, that the NCAA is going to do something with the Tarholes for their transgressions. All that I have heard is speculation on several schools websites, including this one. Has anyone seen anything concrete in this matter? If any kid had any idea that he might be heading to a team on probation, doubt he would go there. This just doesn't seem to be the case. Also , polls that I have seen have them in the preseason top 2 or 3. That also don't make it optimistic that they will get put on probation. Info please.
 
My guess is that Matt will almost certainly start and be a 30 min. guy regardless of who else we recruit b/c of his experience, defense, and general toughness. I think the roles of Kennard / Grayson are far more in flux depending upon what happens with Thornton and Ingram.
 
One thing to keep in mind is that Duke avoided injuries down the stretch. 8 is enough works great if everyone is healthy. Thankfully, that happened in 2015. Woohoo!!!

You can't count on that in general. If anyone had gotten hurt, things would have turned ugly, quick.

And, the 2015 team had the benefit of a preseason and the first third of a season with a full roster of scholarship players. It will be hard to scrimmage in practice if they truly have 8. Having Sheed, Semi, and Obi certainly helped in practice even if they weren't around for the tournament run, no?
 
Originally posted by HuffyJB:

I know Duke won't get both PGs, but I feel certain they will get one. Ingram is the wild card. His high school has the UNC lineage that he is probably inundated with (Stackhouse, Bullock), but Duke offers a different, and I think vastly better scenario for him specifically. I'm optimistic for Duke for a few reasons, primarily that if he really wanted to commit to UNC, he could/would have done that already. They weren't in Duke's situation where they were waiting on decisions from guys who play his position. He knew all along who they would be. Tokota's decision was unexpected, but not a huge wrinkle in that equation I wouldn't think. If he was set on wearing baby blue, what has he been waiting on?
Click to expand...
I honestly feel that the potential NCAA sanctions is what has kept Ingram from signing with UNC. He even said himself that he would have already signed with them if it hadn't been for the scandal. As a result, Duke has made up considerable ground and I feel like it is 50/50 between us and the Cheats.
 
Originally posted by hpnole:
What might really help Duke recruiting would be some sign, I haven't seen any, that the NCAA is going to do something with the Tarholes for their transgressions. All that I have heard is speculation on several schools websites, including this one. Has anyone seen anything concrete in this matter? If any kid had any idea that he might be heading to a team on probation, doubt he would go there. This just doesn't seem to be the case. Also , polls that I have seen have them in the preseason top 2 or 3. That also don't make it optimistic that they will get put on probation. Info please.
Click to expand...
The NCAA has definitely reopened the investigation, which suggests they may / intend to do something. I think the odds are that UNC will have the option of kicking the can down the road enough to avoid serious penalties in 2015, but it's definitively a risk that is out there. I wouldn't be surprised at all, for instance, if UNC finds itself in a position by Jan. 2016 where it feels pressure to self-impose some sanctions or risk getting hit by an even harder hammer later that year -- and, if you're committing in the next two classes, you're really just rolling the dice that nothing happens. The Syracuse case really underscores how abruptly the outlook for a program can change over night.

I'd add that UNC's situation will be particularly tricky b/c they're going to face a tension between imposing sanctions that would hurt the program now and in the future, versus taking a softer approach and running the risk that the NCAA may instead go back and start vacating large amounts of wins -- including the 05 title. For a program like UNC that is very proud of its historical records, my guess is they're going to do whatever they can to protect the 05 and 09 national titles -- even if that means taking a 1-2 year postseason ban and scholarship restrictions. If UNC gets the Syracuse treatment (which would almost certainly implicate the 05 season), suddenly UNC would find itself behind Duke and UK across a number of historical metrics -- ranging from final fours, national titles, and maybe even wins.


This post was edited on 4/15 2:47 PM by aah555
 
Originally posted by HuffyJB:

Also, K has an indisputable track record with guys like him (like-sized combo-ish forwards). Grant Hill, Chris Carrawell, Roshown McCleod, Shane Battier, Luol Deng, Kyle Singler, Jabari Parker, etc. Before the reactionaries get me, I'm not saying Ingram is/will be as good as any of those guys, or that all those guys are the same player, but I think you can see my point. Now, obviously, whether an 18 year old is willing to see it is a different story.
Click to expand...
Ingram doesn't turn 18 until September and is already 6'9 with a 7'3 wingspan. Most reports had him as looking the most impressive during the week of practices for the Mcdonald's game. He also apparently showed well during the Nike Hoop Summit. This kid is just scratching the surface of what he can do and has one of the highest ceilings of anyone in the 2015 class, he would be a massive pickup.



This post was edited on 4/15 11:16 PM by mbdfan
 
Thanks, Dude.

Right now:

G- Kennard
G- Allen
G- Jones
F- Jefferson
F- Jeter
F- Obi
F- Robinson (David's son walking on)
C- Plumlee (appears to be staying in spite of rumors he was leaving?)
C- Vrankovic (new 3-4 star recruit)

Really interesting group. Two premier scholarship players coming in and three very interesting and unique players from their situation (Obi, Robinson, Vrankovic). Maybe the oddest Duke recruiting class in quite some time. As long as these players are patient and work hard I think Obi and V will definitely get opportunities down the road. Especially if they rebound.

8 scholarship players again but Robinson is not your average walk-on. He has potential down the road especially if he has a late growing spurt like his dad did (David started at Navy as a 6'7 kid and grew to 7'0).

The PG is the big question-mark. But, I agree with what someone said above - if we landed Ingram, we might actually be good enough to get away without one (I suspect Kennard can handle it best as a last resort). Ingram would be a big 'get'.
 
If Thorton reclassifies and we can land Ingram, that would be the best situation imaginable for us.
 
Originally posted by CatcherForLife6:
If Thorton reclassifies and we can land Ingram, that would be the best situation imaginable for us.
Click to expand...
Yup. Not sure it would be enough to make us a national title favorite, but it would certainly get us onto the list of 8-10 teams that have a real chance entering the season. If we got Thornton, at a minimum, I think we probably have enough to put together a top 10-15 type team -- though, we'd really need some guys to emerge to make any serious noise in March.
 
DukeJim99 made a great point earlier- 8 is enough when you're coming down the home stretch, and if you avoid injuries. But the reality is, you're most likely going to have an injury here or there- i mean how many of our guys had just simply rolled ankles and such. Definitely need some depth, the addition of Antonio at worst does that. I think at best Antonio can contribute a couple minutes next year and in 2016, perhaps 10 or so min in 2017 depending on the roster. But he does give us another body in practice and in emergencies.

Sounds like Duke sent an offer out to Jamal Murray last night, not 100% confirmed. That to me is really interesting. It is kind of making me nervous too, as i don't want to do anything to disrupt DT- he's the guy we want that is for sure.
 
Originally posted by timo0402:
DukeJim99 made a great point earlier- 8 is enough when you're coming down the home stretch, and if you avoid injuries. But the reality is, you're most likely going to have an injury here or there- i mean how many of our guys had just simply rolled ankles and such. Definitely need some depth, the addition of Antonio at worst does that. I think at best Antonio can contribute a couple minutes next year and in 2016, perhaps 10 or so min in 2017 depending on the roster. But he does give us another body in practice and in emergencies.

Sounds like Duke sent an offer out to Jamal Murray last night, not 100% confirmed. That to me is really interesting. It is kind of making me nervous too, as i don't want to do anything to disrupt DT- he's the guy we want that is for sure.
Click to expand...
+ Even last year proved how important it is to start with more than 8. Injuries, off-the-court issues, transfers, etc. can strike at any moment. While we were able to withstand the Sheed situation and Semi's disillusionment with this role b/c we still had 8 extremely talented players, you can't start the year with 8 -- b/c of the odds of nothing coming up are just not great. And, obviously, entering pre-season practice without enough scholarship bodies to play a full scrimmage is hardly ideal either.

As for Murray, don't know enough about the situation -- but, to the extent that's true, it would suggest to me that Duke's not sure about DT's plans at this point. Murray obviously has talent, but he doesn't come off as a true PG -- and on a team with a number of pretty good scoring guards (and possibly even Ingram) -- I feel we need a more traditional distributor than a combo PG / SG with good ballhandling skills.
 
Originally posted by CatcherForLife6:
If Thorton reclassifies and we can land Ingram, that would be the best situation imaginable for us.
Click to expand...
That would guarantee Duke a spot in the preseason top ten. Not that Duke would go the way of UNC '10 and UK '13 and follow up a National Championship with an NIT appearance, but it still would be nice to be right back in genuine contention, albeit with a revamped cast of characters.
 
Yeah aah, I hear you there... it's so hard to think of a NT for next year when I'm still celebrating this year's title! Ha.


Timo, I think if we can get Tatum (looks good) then we will get either DT and/or Giles... I feel those three aren't as solidified as a package deal as Tyus and Jah were but I think they will strongly consider going to the same school. Also don't forget about Tyus Battle, seems Duke is the heavy favorite with him too. Man, we would be lanky if we could land those 4. Giles 6'10" PF, DT 6'3" PG, Tatum 6"8" SF and Battle 6"6" SG... Which, if those four come to Duke... watch out, I would think we'd be the heavy favorite in 2016. BUT, everything has to fall into place. I do like our chances.
 
Originally posted by CatcherForLife6:
Yeah aah, I hear you there... it's so hard to think of a NT for next year when I'm still celebrating this year's title! Ha.


Timo, I think if we can get Tatum (looks good) then we will get either DT and/or Giles... I feel those three aren't as solidified as a package deal as Tyus and Jah were but I think they will strongly consider going to the same school. Also don't forget about Tyus Battle, seems Duke is the heavy favorite with him too. Man, we would be lanky if we could land those 4. Giles 6'10" PF, DT 6'3" PG, Tatum 6"8" SF and Battle 6"6" SG... Which, if those four come to Duke... watch out, I would think we'd be the heavy favorite in 2016. BUT, everything has to fall into place. I do like our chances.
Click to expand...
Assuming guys stay around, could you imagine Allen, Kennard, Tatum, and Battle all on the same team? Holy cow.
 
That has a very solid chance of happening as it stands today. Anything can happen in recruiting, but we're in solid shape.
 
Why not DT and murray? Duke just won the championship starting two PG's. Why go into the season with one PG, when you can land two. The two of them watched the championship game, so they know it can work.
 
Originally posted by youngman42:
Thanks, Dude.

Right now:

G- Kennard
G- Allen
G- Jones
F- Jefferson
F- Jeter
F- Obi
F- Robinson (David's son walking on)
C- Plumlee (appears to be staying in spite of rumors he was leaving?)
C- Vrankovic (new 3-4 star recruit)

Really interesting group. Two premier scholarship players coming in and three very interesting and unique players from their situation (Obi, Robinson, Vrankovic). Maybe the oddest Duke recruiting class in quite some time. As long as these players are patient and work hard I think Obi and V will definitely get opportunities down the road. Especially if they rebound.

8 scholarship players again but Robinson is not your average walk-on. He has potential down the road especially if he has a late growing spurt like his dad did (David started at Navy as a 6'7 kid and grew to 7'0).

The PG is the big question-mark. But, I agree with what someone said above - if we landed Ingram, we might actually be good enough to get away without one (I suspect Kennard can handle it best as a last resort). Ingram would be a big 'get'.
Click to expand...
If we get a point guard, these guys could be really good again. I don't expect to have another Tyus, but I feel like Luke K should be playing off ball, especially in late game situations.

Obi looks like hes a space eater. Jeter is a great addition. Plumlee, Amile, and Robinson (with Vrankovic redshirted) make our bigs pretty deep. K has the ball rolling big time.
 
Originally posted by dbav:
Originally posted by CatcherForLife6:
Yeah aah, I hear you there... it's so hard to think of a NT for next year when I'm still celebrating this year's title! Ha.


Timo, I think if we can get Tatum (looks good) then we will get either DT and/or Giles... I feel those three aren't as solidified as a package deal as Tyus and Jah were but I think they will strongly consider going to the same school. Also don't forget about Tyus Battle, seems Duke is the heavy favorite with him too. Man, we would be lanky if we could land those 4. Giles 6'10" PF, DT 6'3" PG, Tatum 6"8" SF and Battle 6"6" SG... Which, if those four come to Duke... watch out, I would think we'd be the heavy favorite in 2016. BUT, everything has to fall into place. I do like our chances.
Click to expand...
Assuming guys stay around, could you imagine Allen, Kennard, Tatum, and Battle all on the same team? Holy cow.
Click to expand...
Wow, those guys would be nuts... I'm over here salivating at the possibility of that. A lot to do though!
 
I would expect our squad to look like the following:

1. PG- Derryck Thornton (Freshman)
2. SG- 13 Matt Jones (Junior)
3. SF- Brandon Ingram (Freshman)
4. PF- 21 Amile Jefferson (Senior)
5. C- 34 Sean Obi (Redshirt Sophomore)

6. PG/SG 3 Grayson Allen (Sophomore)
7. PF/C 40 Marshall Plumlee (Redshirt Senior)
8. SG/SF Luke Kennard (Freshman)
9. PF/C Chase Jeter (Freshman)
10. C Frank Vrankovic (Freshman)
11. SF/PF Justin Robinson (Freshman)

When you take into account the fact that Robinson is a walk on and Vrankovic is an obvious redshirt candidate, that gives us 9 rotation players. I think Allen will have a similar role to what Sulaimon was doing at the beginning of the year. He played a lot of minutes as the six man. I think he can bring immediate offense better than Jones could, who is a longer defender. With Thornton being a freshman and starting, that makes Allen and Kennard interchangeable at positions 1-3, so just because they are coming off the bench doesn't mean they won't get playing time. The same goes for Obi/Plumlee. Plumlee is an energy guy who can come in and give us urgency on the glass off the bench. I think Obi is a more complete player at the five. I think Jeter is talented enough to come in and play more than Obi and Plumlee but that remains to be seen. I really hope we land Ingram because he'll immediately start at the three.
 
^ I don't know who ends up starting or getting the most minutes, but that top nine should be able to compete with anyone.
 
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