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One week in

I think Javin can be a 20 minute/night guy, too....but I feel that would be in part because Marques hasn't made the next step, per se. Otherwise I feel he's closer to 10-15 than he is to 20. I'm high on Javin, too, and to an extent, I'm probably higher on him than I am on Marques.
I think Dukedevilz had a great minute breakdown, which I see at this point highly possible, but anything can happen, as we all should know.
 
Javin will get to 20 mpg either because A. Marques isn't "there" yet or B. Javin can play the 3. I would say a better chance of A happening than B.
I hope Javin gets a lot of time this year, however it's unfortunate that were more stacked in the front court than the back court.

so where would that leave minutes for Gary on a regular basis? Most of Gary's minutes may actually have to come from playing the 3 unless Grayson or Tre gets in early foul trouble.
 
so where would that leave minutes for Gary on a regular basis? Most of Gary's minutes may actually have to come from playing the 3 unless Grayson or Tre gets in early foul trouble.
Please go check Dukedevilz post, he gave a great minute breakdown. It seems to be about what everyone either suggests or wants. Sure it could be tweaked, but it will give you an idea.
 
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1) You were the one whining about the first point. In fact, you're the one who constantly whines.

2) Is that something a coach even has to say? I mean, we know that throughout his career he's coached more restrictive than others. A lot of times it's worked, and sometimes it hasn't. Besides, I recall him saying prior to last season we would be deep....and I think that was the thought and plan before everything derailed.

3) I don't think he had a great season, either. I'll refrain from saying terrible because a lot of what happened was simply out of his control, and the team's. When you're introducing six new freshmen --- four of whom you're relying on heavily --- into the mix with four key returnee's, but then can't incorporate three of the four for over month while the fourth battles foot problems, well, it creates obstacles. Could he have done things different? Sure. Do I think he thought he was doing best for the team with what he had? Absolutely. Probably the only certainty we do know is that you were going to complain regardless unless we won the whole thing.


I'm whining because I said Grayson should play 32-34 minutes a game at the 2 and not play point guard at all huh? You need to cut it out hahaha. That's just being realistic. He's not a point guard and it would make more sense to let a point guard relieve the point guard for a few minutes each half.

He always say the team is deep but he plays 7 guys. This time he actually had a reality check that he needs to develop the bench. Only way you can develop them is by letting them play and work through rough times. If we want to keep it real, Coach K is the one that ruined Bolden last year. Bolden played like he was scared to make a mistake when Coach K was there because we know Coach K has a short leash with big guys every since he got small ball crazy. Bolden played his best game when Capel was there and looked much more relaxed. I just hope he actually lets the players play. Javin should've played last year at least 10 minutes a game in that first 10 game stretch. But no he wants to play 5 guards. So like I said Coach K did a piss poor managing job last year. I'll say that if it makes people feel better.
 
Please go check Dukedevilz post, he gave a great minute breakdown. It seems to be about what everyone either suggests or wants. Sure it could be tweaked, but it will give you an idea.

But that's not 20 minutes a game? I hope Grayson doesn't average 38 minutes a game throughout the season. That definitely won't develop depth.
 
I'm whining because I said Grayson should play 32-34 minutes a game at the 2 and not play point guard at all huh? You need to cut it out hahaha. That's just being realistic. He's not a point guard and it would make more sense to let a point guard relieve the point guard for a few minutes each half.

He always say the team is deep but he plays 7 guys. This time he actually had a reality check that he needs to develop the bench. Only way you can develop them is by letting them play and work through rough times. If we want to keep it real, Coach K is the one that ruined Bolden last year. Bolden played like he was scared to make a mistake when Coach K was there because we know Coach K has a short leash with big guys every since he got small ball crazy. Bolden played his best game when Capel was there and looked much more relaxed. I just hope he actually lets the players play. Javin should've played last year at least 10 minutes a game in that first 10 game stretch. But no he wants to play 5 guards. So like I said Coach K did a piss poor managing job last year. I'll say that if it makes people feel better.

This is actually a great post
 
I see no one getting more minutes than Grayson, that's assuming he's the player we all anticipate. Some of your minutes seem ok, but I see Javin getting close to 20 minutes. He's way too athletic and hungry to play less than 15. We must remember there's only so many minutes to go around, unless we're blowing everyone out.
Dachamp, this is what I said. Close to 20.
 
Look, all I have said is that Javin will be most likely in the top 7 of the rotation. I see him playing at least 15 minutes, close to 20. What part of that doesn't make sense? He is a freak athlete and will bring tons of energy to the table.
Not to be mean, but if you've followed Duke basketball at all, you would admit that there's only so many minutes, and that the guys K is most confident in will see those minutes. I didn't say I always agree with K, but it's his program.
Follow Duke basketball? Do you not see any of the irony in your posts? Yes, it's pretty easy to understand that minutes will be limited like they always appear to be under K. You understand that right? If yes, then inform me how in the hell our 4th best big will get 20mpg? You cannot logically do that! Therefore, you can keep singing from the mountain tops about 20mpg but it just isn't going to happen.
 
Follow Duke basketball? Do you not see any of the irony in your posts? Yes, it's pretty easy to understand that minutes will be limited like they always appear to be under K. You understand that right? If yes, then inform me how in the hell our 4th best big will get 20mpg? You cannot logically do that! Therefore, you can keep singing from the mountain tops about 20mpg but it just isn't going to happen.
Does anyone have a map? I have 2 posters that I would like to direct to Mr. Dukedevilz post. For the 3rd time, he gave a WONDERFUL, I mean WONDERFUL, illustration of "possible" minutes.
For the love of God, it was just an opinion. We're not sending encrypted messages here.
You're right about one thing: I cannot logically do it, but it is possible K can, or will.
 
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But that's not 20 minutes a game? I hope Grayson doesn't average 38 minutes a game throughout the season. That definitely won't develop depth.

If my minutes distribution for the 1 and 2 is correct, then you only have to worry about minutes for 5 players and 3 positions. 120 minutes for 5 players comes out to 24 min. per player. That is a nice, healthy average. And Trent is already taking up some of those minutes at the 2 – so he wouldn’t need a full 25+ minutes at playing small forward.

So If Trent gets an additional 19 minutes at the 3, you still have 101 minutes for 4 players. That’s a lot minutes to go around. Javin could easily steal minutes from any of these guys. Most likely they would come from Bolden. Here’s how that would play out:

PG: Duval- 35, Allen- 5
SG: Allen- 33, Trent- 7
SF: Trent- 19, Bagley- 21
PF: Bagley- 14, DeLaurier- 20, Carter- 6
C: Carter- 23, Bolden- 17

Total: Allen- 38, Duval- 35, Bagley- 35, Carter- 29, Trent- 26, DeLaurier- 20, Bolden- 17

Now, as far as playing Grayson 38 minutes a game, that really isn’t the issue. He would only play minutes like that in competitive games. His season average would be closer to 33-35 minutes. If you look at the Duke-UNC Boxscores, you will find crazy-high numbers for at least one player ever year. I don’t expect that to change anytime soon under K.

Recent Competitive Games against UNC:
2001 Shane Battier 39
2002 Mike Dunleavy 39
2003 Dahntay Jones 39
2004 Chris Duhon 39
2005 JJ Redick 40
2006 JJ Redick 39
2007 Jon Scheyer 38
2008 Kyle Singler 37
2009 Jon Scheyer 39
2010 Scheyer/Singler 40
2011 Kyle Singler 40
2012 Austin Rivers 39
2013 Quinn Cook 40
2014 Jabari Parker 35
2015 Quinn Cook 45 (OT)
2016 Ingram/Allen 40
2017 Luke Kennard 39
 
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Now I understand the possible concerns with this lineup. It may not stretch the floor as well. A Bagley-Carter-Bolden trio would eat up a lot of space - and certainly Bagley and Carter can hit jumpers, but we know that's not exactly their forte. So I understand we might use a Jack White or a Jordan Tucker on the wing. We might use Trent for 35 minutes, too. K likes his shooters, for sure. But he also likes to play to his strengths, and our inside game is where we can dominate. Things can change and will change. This is simply my current projection.
 
I'm whining because I said Grayson should play 32-34 minutes a game at the 2 and not play point guard at all huh? You need to cut it out hahaha. That's just being realistic. He's not a point guard and it would make more sense to let a point guard relieve the point guard for a few minutes each half.

He always say the team is deep but he plays 7 guys. This time he actually had a reality check that he needs to develop the bench. Only way you can develop them is by letting them play and work through rough times. If we want to keep it real, Coach K is the one that ruined Bolden last year. Bolden played like he was scared to make a mistake when Coach K was there because we know Coach K has a short leash with big guys every since he got small ball crazy. Bolden played his best game when Capel was there and looked much more relaxed. I just hope he actually lets the players play. Javin should've played last year at least 10 minutes a game in that first 10 game stretch. But no he wants to play 5 guards. So like I said Coach K did a piss poor managing job last year. I'll say that if it makes people feel better.

If you asked me who is the better college point guard today between Grayson and Goldwire, I would say Grayson 10 out of 10 times. I’m not saying Grayson is a true point guard, but as 22-year-old senior, former All-American who has been in the trenches, I’m picking him over Goldwire. Again, it’s not his speciality, but he’s ahead of Goldwire.

And if you think the only way to develop talent is by playing them, then I can’t help you. You’re useless.
 
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Define depth.

Having bodies doesn't always equate to depth. I love Alex O'Connell and Jordan Goldwire, but they're not going to play just because there's perceived depth. Both need to concentrate 1) on improvement, but more importantly, 2) on getting stronger and adjusting to this brand of basketball. They're not in high school anymore.

IMO, I think we really only have three true guards who look like they're ready now....those being Trevon, Grayson and Gary. It's still TBD on Jordan Tucker, although I lean toward him being productive in spots. The main thing we're hearing with regards to him is that he's not much of a defender. That could limit him.
Depth = capacity + ability

I think we have more depth this year then prior ones.
 
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Does anyone have a map? I have 2 posters that I would like to direct to Mr. Dukedevilz post. For the 3rd time, he gave a WONDERFUL, I mean WONDERFUL, illustration of "possible" minutes.
For the love of God, it was just an opinion. We're not sending encrypted messages here.
You're right about one thing: I cannot logically do it, but it is possible K can, or will.
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If my minutes distribution for the 1 and 2 is correct, then you only have to worry about minutes for 5 players and 3 positions. 120 minutes for 5 players comes out to 24 min. per player. That is a nice, healthy average. And Trent is already taking up some of those minutes at the 2 – so he wouldn’t need a full 25+ minutes at playing small forward.

So If Trent gets an additional 19 minutes at the 3, you still have 101 minutes for 4 players. That’s a lot minutes to go around. Javin could easily steal minutes from any of these guys. Most likely they would come from Bolden. Here’s how that would play out:

PG: Duval- 35, Allen- 5
SG: Allen- 33, Trent- 7
SF: Trent- 19, Bagley- 21
PF: Bagley- 14, DeLaurier- 20, Carter- 6
C: Carter- 23, Bolden- 17

Total: Allen- 38, Duval- 35, Bagley- 35, Carter- 29, Trent- 26, DeLaurier- 20, Bolden- 17

Now, as far as playing Grayson 38 minutes a game, that really isn’t the issue. He would only play minutes like that in competitive games. His season average would be closer to 33-35 minutes. If you look at the Duke-UNC Boxscores, you will find crazy-high numbers for at least one player ever year. I don’t expect that to change anytime soon under K.

Recent Competitive Games against UNC:
2001 Shane Battier 39
2002 Mike Dunleavy 39
2003 Dahntay Jones 39
2004 Chris Duhon 39
2005 JJ Redick 40
2006 JJ Redick 39
2007 Jon Scheyer 38
2008 Kyle Singler 37
2009 Jon Scheyer 39
2010 Scheyer/Singler 40
2011 Kyle Singler 40
2012 Austin Rivers 39
2013 Quinn Cook 40
2014 Jabari Parker 35
2015 Quinn Cook 45 (OT)
2016 Ingram/Allen 40
2017 Luke Kennard 39

So basically what you did was the minutes for a given game. That's what it looks like. Because you ended up agreeing with me in the end that Grayson will play between 32-34 minutes per game throughout the season
 
If you asked me who is the better college point guard today between Grayson and Goldwire, I would say Grayson 10 out of 10 times. I’m not saying Grayson is a true point guard, but as 22-year-old senior, former All-American who has been in the trenches, I’m picking him over Goldwire. Again, it’s not his speciality, but he’s ahead of Goldwire.

And if you think the only way to develop talent is by playing them, then I can’t help you. You’re useless.

You need to stop. If you think you can develop a bench and have them ready for tournament time by letting them barely get in the game, I'm glad you aren't coaching anybody's kids
 
In the end he agreed with me that Grayson would play about 32-34 mpg though. He gave you a game minute breakdown. Not season. You tried though
Any reason why you seem so mad? We're all just stating opinions, not cracking nuclear codes here.
To be real clear with you, and I'll type slow here, a game minute breakdown is what a person here is saying as an AVERAGE. Here's the tricky part, so pay attention, that means take ALL minutes played and divide by games played. Got it sport!
 
You need to stop. If you think you can develop a bench and have them ready for tournament time by letting them barely get in the game, I'm glad you aren't coaching anybody's kids


I agree w/you on your premise of player development. We want the best players on the court OBVIOUSLY, but there's a variable for next year at play according to some posters here:They seem to think Vrankovic can step in and perhaps START at the 5 next season. Difficult to fathom figuring most here do not have him in this year's rotation.

OFC
 
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Any reason why you seem so mad? We're all just stating opinions, not cracking nuclear codes here.
To be real clear with you, and I'll type slow here, a game minute breakdown is what a person here is saying as an AVERAGE. Here's the tricky part, so pay attention, that means take ALL minutes played and divide by games played. Got it sport!

I'm not mad at all. You're trying to act like you're so smart but it's not working. Go back to the drawing board. The dude said "His season average would be closer to 33-35 minutes." which means he's agreeing wit me that Grayson won't average 38 minutes a game like some people on here assume. Case closed
 
I'm not mad at all. You're trying to act like you're so smart but it's not working. Go back to the drawing board. The dude said "His season average would be closer to 33-35 minutes." which means he's agreeing wit me that Grayson won't average 38 minutes a game like some people on here assume. Case closed
Don't claim to be smart at all. If you would go back to the original start of this silliness, I said I liked some of your estimated player minutes, but disagreed that anyone would play more than Grayson, and that Javin would play more than 6 minutes a game. Never have I said Grayson should or would play 38-40 a game pal.
Seriously you need to remember its Ready, Aim, Fire. In other words, read what someone says before you question what they say. It will help sir.
 
Don't claim to be smart at all. If you would go back to the original start of this silliness, I said I liked some of your estimated player minutes, but disagreed that anyone would play more than Grayson, and that Javin would play more than 6 minutes a game. Never have I said Grayson should or would play 38-40 a game pal.
Seriously you need to remember its Ready, Aim, Fire. In other words, read what someone says before you question what they say. It will help sir.

I'm trippin. I'm getting you mixed up with the timo dude. He said Grayson that much. My bad
 
I'm trippin. I'm getting you mixed up with the timo dude. He said Grayson that much. My bad

He'll play 40 in close games and probably 33ish in blowouts. He'll be darn close to that 38 average unless we just destroy everybody. Also I agree you have to play them to fully develop idk how anyone thinks differently
 
I'm trippin. I'm getting you mixed up with the timo dude. He said Grayson that much. My bad
Timo dude here checking in. Go find where I said that- or if you want to save yourself the time, just reply to this post in this way, "I'm getting you mixed up with the "enter poster name here" dude. He said Grayson that much. My bad."
 
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Timo dude here checking in. Go find where I said that- or if you want to save yourself the time, just reply to this post in this way, "I'm getting you mixed up with the "enter poster name here" dude. He said Grayson that much. My bad."

Hey "Timo," its a step up from "hall monitor," right??? Hey I have been called much worse ol buddy! OFC
 
I never said any of that. You’re just too stupid to understand....

"And if you think the only way to develop talent is by playing them, then I can’t help you. You’re useless."

This is what you said. How else are you going to develop depth for THIS season if you don't play them in the game you genius? They need game reps to get comfortable. Maybe you didn't know that
 
Timo dude here checking in. Go find where I said that- or if you want to save yourself the time, just reply to this post in this way, "I'm getting you mixed up with the "enter poster name here" dude. He said Grayson that much. My bad."

so if i said he would play around 32-34 mpg what was your point of even saying he will play big minutes in big games? That's obvious. So back to what my original post. Everybody seem to agree with he will play around that 34 mpg area. Didn't need all the extra "big game minute" talk
 
"And if you think the only way to develop talent is by playing them, then I can’t help you. You’re useless."

This is what you said. How else are you going to develop depth for THIS season if you don't play them in the game you genius? They need game reps to get comfortable. Maybe you didn't know that

You’re right. Go ahead and pat yourself on the back.
 
so if i said he would play around 32-34 mpg what was your point of even saying he will play big minutes in big games? That's obvious. So back to what my original post. Everybody seem to agree with he will play around that 34 mpg area. Didn't need all the extra "big game minute" talk
God you're annoying
 
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