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Go on Roy, lie a "LITTLE" (MORE).....

Not like your recruiting could get much worse over the last 7 years. Congrats on actually landing a player in the top 10 for the first time since PJ Hairston.
Now that's a name I like to bring up around my Tarhole friends.
Love to watch them cringe.
 
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Topps that's the one thing that I just can't stand. I'm not on here bashing Roy all day, not my style, but the fact that he's being called out time after time is quite comical. And again yesterday in a Pat Forde article which basically just laughed at the notion that any coach that says they are shocked is just flat out full of it. It's not a lie, if you believe it!
 
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Right but that comment that he knew nothing even while there is laughable. If Gary on his couch knows then he knows...bad example.

While at Kansas? Or Chapel Hill. Because we don't exactly know when addidas started this whole thing.

Look, I'm on record saying Roy wasn't being truthful when he said he was shocked that this kind of thing happens. He knew it went on, K knows it goes on, everyone did. Doesn't mean he was receiving kickbacks at Kansas or UNC.
 
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While at Kansas? Or Chapel Hill. Because we don't exactly know when addidas started this whole thing.

Look, I'm on record saying Roy wasn't being truthful when he said he was shocked that this kind of thing happens. He knew it went on, K knows it goes on, everyone did. Doesn't mean he was receiving kickbacks at Kansas or UNC.

The fact hes been PRACTICALLY stealing $$$ based on APR scores at UNC during AFAM is shameful. The man has no shame...

OFC
 
Appears that FBI is looking at Kansas Addidas contacts now.Maybe nothing is there but interesting that one person is connected to the two biggest scandals in college bb history,but of course he had no knowledge of either of them at both schools

Is Roy connected at all though to the FBI probe? As far as we know, he isn't. I get that Little committed to them right after this whole thing broke, but I don't think it means it whole lot. It just means Little's top choice --- Arizona --- was out of the running.

Now, I'll be the first to admit that Roy's "golly, oh jeez" thing gets played up and makes me want to vomit. He pretends to be some dumb, country bumpkin, but I'm not buying it. He knew about the AFAM thing. No one can ever convince me he didn't.
 
The fact hes been PRACTICALLY stealing $$$ based on APR scores at UNC during AFAM is shameful. The man has no shame...

OFC

That's a bit hyperbolic, no? He's not actually receiving money because of what happened with the academic scandal. Roy isn't perfect but he's not a crook.
 
That's a bit hyperbolic, no? He's not actually receiving money because of what happened with the academic scandal. Roy isn't perfect but he's not a crook.

I would agree. I really think both K and Roy are good men. It doesn't mean they don't have their faults. K has said some things that have made me roll my eyes over the years and made himself a target, as had Roy. I also think part of that is because they'd rather have the media and fans talking about them than their kids.

I can see how K comes across self-centered. Especially if that's how I wanted to portray him in my mind. I also think Roy flat-out lied about knowing nothing with regards to AFAM.
 
I would agree. I really think both K and Roy are good men. It doesn't mean they don't have their faults. K has said some things that have made me roll my eyes over the years and made himself a target, as had Roy. I also think part of that is because they'd rather have the media and fans talking about them than their kids.

I can see how K comes across self-centered. Especially if that's how I wanted to portray him in my mind. I also think Roy flat-out lied about knowing nothing with regards to AFAM.

I'm on a duke board right now, so I can't precisely speak to the extent of my opinion on whether or not Roy knew about AFAM. Do I sincerely hope he didn't know? Yes. But are the odds likely that he didn't? No.

As for the rest of your statement, I agree completely.
 
That's a bit hyperbolic, no? He's not actually receiving money because of what happened with the academic scandal. Roy isn't perfect but he's not a crook.

The man had to know EVEN BY ACCIDENT about AFAM. With an office across from Wayne Walden his right hand academic liaison???!!! Who are you trying to fool on this board.... I dont have to PC it as I am not a mod....I prefer to borrow from others (including plugged in insiders who wrote books on the subject)....Your coach knew and that "aw shucks" facade he hides behind is baloney.....

It all goes back to Matt Doherty who was told by Dean (pre-Alzheimers stage): "dont change academics." OFC
 
The man had to know EVEN BY ACCIDENT about AFAM. With an office across from Wayne Walden his right hand academic liaison???!!! Who are you trying to fool on this board.... I dont have to PC it as I am not a mod....I prefer to borrow from others (including plugged in insiders who wrote books on the subject)....Your coach knew and that "aw shucks" facade he hides behind is baloney.....

It all goes back to Matt Doherty who was told by Dean (pre-Alzheimers stage): "dont change academics." OFC

You damn right Roy knew! His hillbilly ass isn't fooling anyone!
 
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The man had to know EVEN BY ACCIDENT about AFAM. With an office across from Wayne Walden his right hand academic liaison???!!! Who are you trying to fool on this board.... I dont have to PC it as I am not a mod....I prefer to borrow from others (including plugged in insiders who wrote books on the subject)....Your coach knew and that "aw shucks" facade he hides behind is baloney.....

It all goes back to Matt Doherty who was told by Dean (pre-Alzheimers stage): "dont change academics." OFC

Knowing or not knowing about an academic scandal is not the same as directly receiving money from it. That's what I'm getting at. He's not evil incarnate as you're making him out to be.
 
Is Roy connected at all though to the FBI probe? As far as we know, he isn't. I get that Little committed to them right after this whole thing broke, but I don't think it means it whole lot. It just means Little's top choice --- Arizona --- was out of the running.

Now, I'll be the first to admit that Roy's "golly, oh jeez" thing gets played up and makes me want to vomit. He pretends to be some dumb, country bumpkin, but I'm not buying it. He knew about the AFAM thing. No one can ever convince me he didn't.
Never said he was but his Sgt Shultz I know nothing shtick is a constant theme for him unless it is something favorable.For example he knew everything about his kids class work when the Carolina Way myth was was accepted.I seriously doubt he had anything to do with this at KU,but the fact he is getting an award about being an example of honesty is laughable
 
TRUE....Hes likely WORSE.....

OFC

hahaha. Roy isn't a horrible person by any means. I couldn't imagine what Roy has endured throughout his "Haiti" crisis, years of academic scandals, years of Wanda's nanner pudding, and possibly a drought from Coca-cola. I'm sure he's suffering from "Post Traumatic Hemorrhoids", which sends him into a dramatic power squat position, we've all seen before!

D144KOs.jpg
 
Knowing or not knowing about an academic scandal is not the same as directly receiving money from it. That's what I'm getting at. He's not evil incarnate as you're making him out to be.

I was largely with you until this. I certainly understand it doesn't mean he received money from it, but I think the point is if he knew, and he's the great guy some think he is, then why didn't he do anything to correct it?

And, arguably he did receive money in the form of contracts and contract extensions, of increased value, that he received based upon the success he had with players he knew were cheating. That is an argument that can absolutely be made.

Do I think that Roy or anyone associated with him offered money to recruit? No, I think he is sly and smarter than that. I also believe he is a better person than that, despite his other failings in my eyes. I also don't think he would have taken Little knowing what is going on if he thought the program was involved in any respect. Do I think he failed by not taking care of a situation he knew to be fraudulent? Yes, and there is no question about that in my mind.

Again, I get what you have been saying in this thread, and I largely agree with you. But I am tired of the argument "every party is dirty in some respect". That's a cop out that people use to rationalize their own crappy behavior. Frankly, it should be beneath a real fan.

I for one don't believe our program is dirty at all. I don't think most of the ACC programs are, or mid-majors, or at least 90% of the programs out there. I think it's time for some to stop rationalizing and to own it. I have a lot more respect for people that say "yeah, I screwed up, I'm going to fix it", than those that say "yeah, I screwed up, but look at all these other people that screwed up as much or worse". Is that the company they really want to keep?

Time to man up on it. If you want to take the high road, you'd better work your ass off to stay on it. I'm not saying that to you individually because I believe you are mad as hell at the academic shenanigans, but to many in your fan base. I would be mad as hell at my alma mater if I found out they were cheating. I also believe you are a good fan and someone with a lot of common sense and dignity, so this isn't really directed at you as much as those that do rationalize because it makes them sound to cowardly to admit there was a problem that needed fixing.

End rant, haha. Sorry, I don't usually write this much.
 
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How do you guys explain unc getting to back to back title games ? From reading here, it seems like you all mostly think the academic scandal just created this gigantic wormhole for Roy straight to the final four. If that was the case youd think once the "cheating" stopped unc wouldnt be able to pull off such a feat ...yet they did. . even without recruiting close to Unc type standards. So are they still cheating? Roy maybe can coach? Coincidence? Black hole opened up over saturn? I know mostly youre just busting balls but I think maybe a few actually really believe it.
 
Jurkin I always like
I was largely with you until this. I certainly understand it doesn't mean he received money from it, but I think the point is if he knew, and he's the great guy some think he is, then why didn't he do anything to correct it?

And, arguably he did receive money in the form of contracts and contract extensions, of increased value, that he received based upon the success he had with players he knew were cheating. That is an argument that can absolutely be made.

Do I think that Roy or anyone associated with him offered money to recruit? No, I think he is sly and smarter than that. I also believe he is a better person than that, despite his other failings in my eyes. I also don't think he would have taken Little knowing what is going on if he thought the program was involved in any respect. Do I think he failed by not taking care of a situation he knew to be fraudulent? Yes, and there is no question about that in my mind.

Again, I get what you have been saying in this thread, and I largely agree with you. But I am tired of the argument "every party is dirty in some respect". That's a cop out that people use to rationalize their own crappy behavior. Frankly, it should be beneath a real fan.

I for one don't believe our program is dirty at all. I don't think most of the ACC programs are, or mid-majors, or at least 90% of the programs out there. I think it's time for some to stop rationalizing and to own it. I have a lot more respect for people that say "yeah, I screwed up, I'm going to fix it", than those that say "yeah, I screwed up, but look at all these other people that screwed up as much or worse". Is that the company they really want to keep?

Time to man up on it. If you want to take the high road, you'd better work your ass off to stay on it. I'm not saying that to you individually because I believe you are mad as hell at the academic shenanigans, but to many in your fan base. I would be mad as hell at my alma mater if I found out they were cheating. I also believe you are a good fan and someone with a lot of common sense and dignity, so this isn't really directed at you as much as those that do rationalize because it makes them sound to cowardly to admit there was a problem that needed fixing.

End rant, haha. Sorry, I don't usually write this much.

No need to apologize for your thoughts my friend-job well done...OFC
 
How do you guys explain unc getting to back to back title games ? From reading here, it seems like you all mostly think the academic scandal just created this gigantic wormhole for Roy straight to the final four. If that was the case youd think once the "cheating" stopped unc wouldnt be able to pull off such a feat ...yet they did. . even without recruiting close to Unc type standards. So are they still cheating? Roy maybe can coach? Coincidence? Black hole opened up over saturn? I know mostly youre just busting balls but I think maybe a few actually really believe it.

I think Roy can coach. I also think he's benefiting from cheating. They are not mutually exclusive.
 
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How do you guys explain unc getting to back to back title games ? From reading here, it seems like you all mostly think the academic scandal just created this gigantic wormhole for Roy straight to the final four. If that was the case youd think once the "cheating" stopped unc wouldnt be able to pull off such a feat ...yet they did. . even without recruiting close to Unc type standards. So are they still cheating? Roy maybe can coach? Coincidence? Black hole opened up over saturn? I know mostly youre just busting balls but I think maybe a few actually really believe it.


You mean retaining multiple top 15 recruits for 3/4 years. Hell, if K was able to pull that off, CIS would overflow with banners. Unlike Roy, K believes in getting his players to the NBA quickly.
 
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I was largely with you until this. I certainly understand it doesn't mean he received money from it, but I think the point is if he knew, and he's the great guy some think he is, then why didn't he do anything to correct it?

And, arguably he did receive money in the form of contracts and contract extensions, of increased value, that he received based upon the success he had with players he knew were cheating. That is an argument that can absolutely be made.

Do I think that Roy or anyone associated with him offered money to recruit? No, I think he is sly and smarter than that. I also believe he is a better person than that, despite his other failings in my eyes. I also don't think he would have taken Little knowing what is going on if he thought the program was involved in any respect. Do I think he failed by not taking care of a situation he knew to be fraudulent? Yes, and there is no question about that in my mind.

Again, I get what you have been saying in this thread, and I largely agree with you. But I am tired of the argument "every party is dirty in some respect". That's a cop out that people use to rationalize their own crappy behavior. Frankly, it should be beneath a real fan.

I for one don't believe our program is dirty at all. I don't think most of the ACC programs are, or mid-majors, or at least 90% of the programs out there. I think it's time for some to stop rationalizing and to own it. I have a lot more respect for people that say "yeah, I screwed up, I'm going to fix it", than those that say "yeah, I screwed up, but look at all these other people that screwed up as much or worse". Is that the company they really want to keep?

Time to man up on it. If you want to take the high road, you'd better work your ass off to stay on it. I'm not saying that to you individually because I believe you are mad as hell at the academic shenanigans, but to many in your fan base. I would be mad as hell at my alma mater if I found out they were cheating. I also believe you are a good fan and someone with a lot of common sense and dignity, so this isn't really directed at you as much as those that do rationalize because it makes them sound to cowardly to admit there was a problem that needed fixing.

End rant, haha. Sorry, I don't usually write this much.
Very well stated. I think Roy is a good coach. I think he wouldn't have taken Little if there was even a hint of anything that would suggest there was pay for play surrounding the kid.

The point is and for always has been, don't play dumb. You cheated (re: the scandal)- I don't expect you to say anything but to say you didn't know is just flat out lying and a horrible excuse.

And maybe unc did lose some kids bc of the kids being paid- but to act like every single one that didn't go your way was bc someone paid for them and they really wanted to go to unc is disingenuous and so many on THR actually follow garys lead on that. It's just a cop out.

As far as unc winning the ship- I think they just kind of backdoored their way into it. Two very good teams don't get me wrong, but they were the product of a ton of things going absolutely perfectly . To be fair that's largely how a lot of champions in a one and done tournament go.
 
Thank you Dukie Jay!! You my man LOVE to quote my posts!!! Now you know I dont mind going toe to toe with you on debates anytime, but I find myself perplexed there are some Duke folks who post here (and I am not going to mention any names) you avoid conflict with like the plague....Interesting...Just an observation.. (You know who they are, you're a smart dude)...

However, dont you think all of these folks here have a right to retaliate to the UNC folks?? They may have their own backstory previously over at THR and who blames them for firing back? This isnt world peace. This is Duke-Carolina and I am an NC native and I have lived it all my life.

UNC fans act has gotten old per the scandal and the hangers on have only increased in off-season because they broke their drought this year. I stand by what I said dude... Peace out...OFC

Hart -- I have never seen DJ avoid conflict with anyone. There are a couple of things that I really like about this board:
1. A bunch of sincere Duke fans -- lots who know more than me about Duke basketball.
2. Mods that are NOT trigger happy to ban OPs. Sometimes we all have to grit our teeth and sometimes I wish that some people would just go away, but in general I feel this board is better than most.
3. In general, I have noticed that most Duke fans that post on the national board stick up for each other. I have seen a number of guys from RR and THR were they get crucified on their own board.

So, when DJ thinks that we are not behaving well, I take notice. I try to not be a d!ckhead, because I really don't have to -- I am a fan of Duke and Coach K....I am not an embittered whackball. AND sometimes I HAVE been a d!ckhead and I HAVE been a whackball, I don't mind if this crew reminds me of those times -- iron sharpens iron.

** A suggestion to mods ** can we have a sticky note at the top on Lance and Cory? Would love for it to be a FAQ -- that way when some troll comes along and says "What about Lance?!" we could just point them to the FAQs. This is because I'm just lazy....hate having to re-type stuff.
 
You mean retaining multiple top 15 recruits for 3/4 years. Hell, if K was able to pull that off, CIS would overflow with banners. Unlike Roy, K believes in getting his players to the NBA quickly.


Don’t disagree but would clarify K seems to stay out of their decision more (at least in this current era) and builds an offense around his best offensive players (no matter their class).
 
Knowing or not knowing about an academic scandal is not the same as directly receiving money from it. That's what I'm getting at. He's not evil incarnate as you're making him out to be.
No @carolinablue34 , Coach Williams is not evil incarnate -- just the successful coach of our rival. He is fiercely competitive and likes to win. He is also thin-skinned, plays the "aw-shucks shtick" too much, and has a tendency to implode in high-pressure, end-game situations. For a rival, he provides us with a lot of material to work with....and yes, I am pretty sure that he had a good idea of what was going on with the AFAM situation.
 
Hart -- I have never seen DJ avoid conflict with anyone. There are a couple of things that I really like about this board:
1. A bunch of sincere Duke fans -- lots who know more than me about Duke basketball.
2. Mods that are NOT trigger happy to ban OPs. Sometimes we all have to grit our teeth and sometimes I wish that some people would just go away, but in general I feel this board is better than most.
3. In general, I have noticed that most Duke fans that post on the national board stick up for each other. I have seen a number of guys from RR and THR were they get crucified on their own board.

So, when DJ thinks that we are not behaving well, I take notice. I try to not be a d!ckhead, because I really don't have to -- I am a fan of Duke and Coach K....I am not an embittered whackball. AND sometimes I HAVE been a d!ckhead and I HAVE been a whackball, I don't mind if this crew reminds me of those times -- iron sharpens iron.

** A suggestion to mods ** can we have a sticky note at the top on Lance and Cory? Would love for it to be a FAQ -- that way when some troll comes along and says "What about Lance?!" we could just point them to the FAQs. This is because I'm just lazy....hate having to re-type stuff.

Breaking:

LT is Trending w/mods... Good job dude, scored yourself some points there! OFC
 
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No @carolinablue34 , Coach Williams is not evil incarnate -- just the successful coach of our rival. He is fiercely competitive and likes to win. He is also thin-skinned, plays the "aw-shucks shtick" too much, and has a tendency to implode in high-pressure, end-game situations. For a rival, he provides us with a lot of material to work with....and yes, I am pretty sure that he had a good idea of what was going on with the AFAM situation.


Lol, I think its beyond "pretty sure" when he's thrown out so many different quotes the last several years, he refused to meet w/Mary Willingham, and his own academic liaison once said "he couldnt recall" if he told Roy about the fake classes or not.

On top of this, when you are in recruits living rooms promising "world class educations" its your responsibility to know! OFC
 
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How do you guys explain unc getting to back to back title games ? From reading here, it seems like you all mostly think the academic scandal just created this gigantic wormhole for Roy straight to the final four. If that was the case youd think once the "cheating" stopped unc wouldnt be able to pull off such a feat ...yet they did. . even without recruiting close to Unc type standards. So are they still cheating? Roy maybe can coach? Coincidence? Black hole opened up over saturn? I know mostly youre just busting balls but I think maybe a few actually really believe it.

Sometimes it’s best to just ignore certain posters. They’re trying to get you riled, but don’t necessarily represent the majority. I mean, you wouldn’t want me to think guys like DSouthr, Gary and Steat were the top brass of the UNC fan base, correct? I’m going to assume we can both agree on that.

Now to seriously answer your question(s). No, I don’t think UNC is still cheating. I don’t think they needed to cheat to begin with....and honestly, I doubt that the original intent was for it to turn into what it did, but regardless, it still did.

Also, Roy is a very good coach. He’s not the most likable guy in the world to me, but you probably feel the same about K. That’s fine. We should differ in that respect.

While UNCs recruiting dropped off some, it didn’t disappear. They still had more HS All-Americans than probably all but four or five schools in the country....so it’s not as if they were a bunch of chumps. And last season, much like for us back in 2010, things kind of magically happened, almost as if it was destiny. Just think, if Arkansas doesn’t implode the last three minutes the Heels are out a few hours before us, or Baylor doesn’t turn the ball over three times in two minutes we don’t get to Indy in 2010. Very minute circumstances can entirely change an NCAAT. As Duke and UNC fans, we should know that firsthand. While both programs have five titles in the last three decades or so, both could conceivably have a handful more. That’s just how the tournament works. Be really good and at the same time, not only catch the breaks, but take advantage of them.
 
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